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509 LS Edge Trigger Configurations

1426 Views 6 Replies 3 Participants Last post by  AhhCheew
Trigger Pull Video

Summary:

Flat trigger makes the break more defined\harder. With apex sear seems to break earlier. Snap break no matter what striker is used. Definition of break changes with striker used, shooting sight being the lightest and apex the hardest. Apex/Edge striker has very slight creep shooting sight has none.

Apex trigger adds creep and softens the break no matter what striker is used. Pull/break is very sloppy when used with a stock sear. Rolling break for apex/edge striker. Light snap break with the tiniest hint of creep with shooting sight striker.

Apex striker = Adds noticeable pull weight no matter the configuration. Would only recommend if you don’t have the edge striker and would prefer a rolling break.

Edge striker = Paired with the apex trigger/sear is the perfect setup for people who prefer a rolling break.

Shooting sight striker = Is perfect for people who prefer no creep. For a more defined break use with stock trigger for a softer break use apex.


I finally got around to testing all the combinations of parts that I have. Full mcarbo spring kit installed. Parts/springs have been polished except shooting sight striker. I don’t have a regular 509 striker so I wasn’t able to include it in my testing. Used a wheeler trigger scale pulling on the lowest possible point of shoe. Sorry I didn’t do a more detailed test of the components like take any measurements for distance of takeup/creep or marked the trigger guard with tape to see pull length, etc. Hope this helps everyone!

ST = Stock (LS Edge) Trigger

AT = Apex (Flat) Trigger

SS = Stock Sear

AS = Apex (Updated/Jagged Edge) Sear

SSr = Stock (LS Edge) Striker

ASr = Apex Striker

ShSr = Shooting Sight Striker (Long Tail)

ST+SS+SSr = Soft wall with a rolling break. Trigger seems/feels like it breaks earlier in the pull. 2lb8oz

ST+SS+ASr = Defined wall with slight roll/creep before break. Break also seems/feels earlier in the pull. 3lb4oz

ST+SS+ShSr = Most defined wall with a snap break. Very similar to the same combination but with the apex trigger. Wall seems a bit more defined and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb12oz

ST+AS+SSr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than same setup with Apex Striker. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb6oz

ST+AS+ASr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than the same setup with the stock sear. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb14oz

ST+AS+ShSr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Snap break with no creep at all. 2lb12oz

AT+SS+SSr = Defined wall with a rolling break. Similar to the same setup with the apex striker except a lighter pull weight. This also seems to break all the way towards the end of the trigger pull. 2lb14oz

AT+SS+ASr = Defined wall with a rolling break but with more resistance/weight. This setup seems to break further towards the end of the trigger pull. 3lb6oz

AT+SS+ShSr = Has the most defined wall and a snap break no creep/roll at all. 2lb10oz

AT+AS+SSr = Rolling break with a soft wall. 2lb10oz

AT+AS+ASr = Rolling break with a more defined (still soft) wall and less creep. 3lbs

AT+AS+ShSr = Snap break with a very slight hint of creep. 2lb8oz
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If you want to finish out the testing, let me know - I have some strikers with an extended tail that I think solve the Apex issue.
If I re-order your data to look at individual variables. Start with trigger:

Codes
ST = Stock (LS Edge) Trigger
AT = Apex (Flat) Trigger

SS = Stock Sear
AS = Apex (Updated/Jagged Edge) Sear

SSr = Stock (LS Edge) Striker
ASr = Apex Striker
ShSr = Shooting Sight Striker


ST+SS+SSr = Soft wall with a rolling break. Trigger seems/feels like it breaks earlier in the pull. 2lb8oz
AT+SS+SSr = Defined wall with a rolling break. Similar to the same setup with the apex striker except a lighter pull weight. This also seems to break all the way towards the end of the trigger pull 2lb14oz

ST+SS+ASr = Defined wall with slight roll/creep before break. Break also seems/feels earlier in the pull. 3lb4oz
AT+SS+ASr = Defined wall with a rolling break but with more resistance/weight. This setup seems to break further towards the end of the trigger pull. 3lb6oz

ST+SS+ShSr = Most defined wall with a snap break. Very similar to the same combination but with the apex trigger. Wall seems a bit more defined and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb12oz
AT+SS+ShSr = Has the most defined wall and a snap break no creep/roll at all. 2lb10oz

ST+AS+SSr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than same setup with Apex Striker. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb6oz
AT+AS+SSr = Rolling break with a soft wall 2lb10oz

ST+AS+ASr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than the same setup with the stock sear. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb14oz
AT+AS+ASr = Rolling break with a more defined (still soft) wall and less creep (roll before break) 3lbs

ST+AS+ShSr = Couldn’t test due to apex sear.
AT+AS+ShSr = Couldn’t test because trigger would not reset properly with the updated/jagged apex sear.

The above five tests (not counting the last) put the stock trigger versus flat trigger in apples-apples tests. In four, the Apex trigger resulted in a higher pull, in one it was less, so it seems the flat trigger increases pull slightly. In terms of wall definition, one test was better for Apex, three did not show a difference, one was better for stock, so inconclusive that there is a difference.

Now, re-order to compare stock versus Apex sears in single variable tests:

ST+SS+SSr = Soft wall with a rolling break. Trigger seems/feels like it breaks earlier in the pull. 2lb8oz
ST+AS+SSr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than same setup with Apex Striker. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb6oz

ST+SS+ASr = Defined wall with slight roll/creep before break. Break also seems/feels earlier in the pull. 3lb4oz
ST+AS+ASr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than the same setup with the stock sear. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb14oz

ST+SS+ShSr = Most defined wall with a snap break. Very similar to the same combination but with the apex trigger. Wall seems a bit more defined and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb12oz
ST+AS+ShSr = Couldn’t test due to apex sear.

AT+SS+SSr = Defined wall with a rolling break. Similar to the same setup with the apex striker except a lighter pull weight. This also seems to break all the way towards the end of the trigger pull 2lb14oz
AT+AS+SSr = Rolling break with a soft wall 2lb10oz

AT+SS+ASr = Defined wall with a rolling break but with more resistance/weight. This setup seems to break further towards the end of the trigger pull. 3lb6oz
AT+AS+ASr = Rolling break with a more defined (still soft) wall and less creep (roll before break) 3lbs

AT+SS+ShSr = Has the most defined wall and a snap break no creep/roll at all. 2lb10oz
AT+AS+ShSr = Couldn’t test because trigger would not reset properly with the updated/jagged apex sear.

In the above 6 tests, only 4 were completed. In all four, the Apex sear reduced pull. For wall definition, one rated Apex striker better, one rated stock better, two were tied. For rolling break, one was better for Apex, three were tied.

In the last comparisons, where the striker is the single variable:

ST+SS+SSr = Soft wall with a rolling break. Trigger seems/feels like it breaks earlier in the pull. 2lb8oz
ST+AS+SSr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than same setup with Apex Striker. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb6oz
AT+SS+SSr = Defined wall with a rolling break. Similar to the same setup with the apex striker except a lighter pull weight. This also seems to break all the way towards the end of the trigger pull 2lb14oz
AT+AS+SSr = Rolling break with a soft wall 2lb10oz

ST+SS+ASr = Defined wall with slight roll/creep before break. Break also seems/feels earlier in the pull. 3lb4oz
ST+AS+ASr = Feels/seems like less takeup/pretravel. Defined wall but softer than the same setup with the stock sear. Slight roll before break and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb14oz
AT+SS+ASr = Defined wall with a rolling break but with more resistance/weight. This setup seems to break further towards the end of the trigger pull. 3lb6oz
AT+AS+ASr = Rolling break with a more defined (still soft) wall and less creep (roll before break) 3lbs

ST+SS+ShSr = Most defined wall with a snap break. Very similar to the same combination but with the apex trigger. Wall seems a bit more defined and break seems/feels earlier in the pull. 2lb12oz
ST+AS+ShSr = Couldn’t test due to apex sear.
AT+SS+ShSr = Has the most defined wall and a snap break no creep/roll at all. 2lb10oz
AT+AS+ShSr = Couldn’t test because trigger would not reset properly with the updated/jagged apex sear.

In the striker only comparisons: Stock versus Apex, the Apex had a higher pull weight in all four comparisons. Compared to stock, the ShootingSight Striker was higher in one test, lower in the other. Compared to Apex, the ShootingSight striker had lower pull in both tests. In terms of break, there is no difference between stock and Apex. However ShootingSight striker had a more defined wall and a sharper break than any other combination.

Taking the best of each category, it seems the stock trigger, with the Apex sear, and the ShootingSight striker should give the best overall .... even though that particular combination was not tested.

Art
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Don't remember exactly - I did this development several years ago, where I took a stock sear and ground 0.010 off the tail, tested it, took another 0.010 off .... and repeated till it failed, then picked a number that was less, but not crazy less. The best way to compare it is to look at the creep - the distance the trigger travels between hitting the second stage, and the position the hammer releases. In my testing, I was 70% of the creep seen in the stock striker.

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