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Discussion Starter #1
I need schooled in 9mm. Been looking for one to increase my shooting enjoyment. However, I know nothing of the round. I’m looking at a PA-63
http://www.centerfiresystems.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=319
Anyway to make a long story short, is the 9 x 18 the same as the 9 mm lugar? Or are these two different kinds of rounds?

If any one has experience with these and want to add I’d appreciate it. I have PP’s and like them, however I don’t shoot them often because they are WWII vintage. And they are .32 cal and not much cheaper than .45’s.

Thanks so much,
 
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No, it is NOT the same.

It is a Makarov cartridge (9x18) - its power is between 9x19 Luger and 380 Auto.

I found this online:

The 9mm Makarov pistol and 9x18 cartridge were adopted as the service standard by the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics after WW II, and almost all of the other Communist nations quickly followed suit, including China. In the Soviet Union it served the various branches of the military, the KGB, the police, and all other government agencies. "Standard" meant just that in the USSR.
I think ammo for this will not be as inexpensive as 9mm Luger.

You want 9x19
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Does anyone have a Beretta 92F? How do you like it? How do you like it compared to other 9's?
 

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I've owned a few over the years - I had one from 1998-2005. It is a great gun. Least recoiling 9mm I've shot. The metal frame sucks up the recoil. It does have a long trigger.

The slide moves on the frame like ball bearings.

If U don't care about the appearance of your weapon, then its no big deal - but otherwise, as U shoot the gun, you'll develop wear on the front part of your barrel. And, since it is an open slide design, U see it. The stainless 92's suffer a lot less from that than the black ones do.
 

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CHICAGO TYPEWRITER said:
I need schooled in 9mm. Been looking for one to increase my shooting enjoyment. However, I know nothing of the round. I’m looking at a PA-63
http://www.centerfiresystems.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=319
Anyway to make a long story short, is the 9 x 18 the same as the 9 mm lugar? Or are these two different kinds of rounds?

If any one has experience with these and want to add I’d appreciate it. I have PP’s and like them, however I don’t shoot them often because they are WWII vintage. And they are .32 cal and not much cheaper than .45’s.

Thanks so much,
Save yourself $10.00 Go here: http://aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Hungarian_PA63_9x18Mak_Pistol.html

I like FEG. Had a 380 but it was stolen along with my S&W 686 and my Wyoming Arms 10mm.

The even sadder part is that my father was in WWII and gave me a Jap sniper rifle with the bayonet, complete to include the cleaning kit. For safety reasons, I kept the bolt with the 380 in a locked box. Now the 380 and the bolt are gone and I now have a nice WWII Jap paperweight with an exceptionally long letter opener.

If I ever find the f()&#%$^ that ripped me off, it is toast time....
 

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HK SD9 Tactical said:
CHICAGO TYPEWRITER said:
I need schooled in 9mm. Been looking for one to increase my shooting enjoyment. However, I know nothing of the round. I’m looking at a PA-63
http://www.centerfiresystems.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=319
Anyway to make a long story short, is the 9 x 18 the same as the 9 mm lugar? Or are these two different kinds of rounds?

If any one has experience with these and want to add I’d appreciate it. I have PP’s and like them, however I don’t shoot them often because they are WWII vintage. And they are .32 cal and not much cheaper than .45’s.

Thanks so much,
Save yourself $10.00 Go here: http://aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Hungarian_PA63_9x18Mak_Pistol.html

I like FEG. Had a 380 but it was stolen along with my S&W 686 and my Wyoming Arms 10mm.

The even sadder part is that my father was in WWII and gave me a Jap sniper rifle with the bayonet, complete to include the cleaning kit. For safety reasons, I kept the bolt with the 380 in a locked box. Now the 380 and the bolt are gone and I now have a nice WWII Jap paperweight with an exceptionally long letter opener.

If I ever find the f()&#%$^ that ripped me off, it is toast time....

DAM THATS ****Y But if you find the rifle it will have the same ware marks in the recever as the old bolt that 100% proof of ownership!!!i would be checking pawn shops...
 

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I don't have a 92FS, but I do have some 9mm's and I like them all. Fun and cheap to shoot, and not a bad personal defense round either. Before you buy one, I would at least hold if not rent/shoot...

SIG P228 or P226
Walther P99AS
Glock 17
Springfield XD9

TA
 

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CHICAGO TYPEWRITER said:
What's the difference between the 92, 96 and 90-two?
92 is 9mm. 96 is the same gun in 40 cal.

90-Two is the updated design. The slide is shaped differently, it has a rail, and the grip is interchangeable (but U must buy the 2nd grip option separately). I won one last July here locally at the Beretta Range Day. I prefer the older 92 design with the Hogue grip panels. I found the plastic grip and front strap on the 90-Two to be too slippery. Anyway, at the time, I didn't want another Beretta, so I sold it while it was still new.

That is the only reason I have my PS90. It paid for 1/2 of my gun :)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Ship, I think I may buy a 92 here used. Does $450 sound about right? I’ve looked at a lot of 9mm here lately, 1911’s are way to expensive right now in 9mm. I’ve only been able to find a Kimber Wart hog in 9mm and $1200 dollars would whole lotta something else I want too! I’m not a plastic pistol kind of guy so that takes out big lots of other 9mm's. I’m also enthused by the Beretta’s simplistic take down. I’ve not read a whole lot of bad things about them, and if the US military uses them they can’t be all that bad. I know how you like your ‘99, I”ve looked at the P99 (Walther is fav.) several times and I love my p22 but I think I’ll pass on the ‘99 for now. Besides if the military goes with another contract the parts sets for Berettas should plenty cheap in the future! 8) I like old military surplus stuff that appeals to me also! I"m really excited about doubling my range shots! I think I'm going to have to lay off the Tommy's this year! :? I'm hoping this ammo crunch will end soon! Between gas the SUV's and buying .45's rounds to shoot I'm going poor! 1 tank of gas $65, 200 round of .45 $55 dollars is too much for 45 minutes of fun! Thanks for all the help!
 

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$450 is too high for a used one now. They dropped the price several months ago. I can buy a new one at Houston gunshows for $409 - $425.

Granted, I SOLD my prev one for $450 a couple of years back - but I lucked out. The next show I went to 2-3 months after I sold it, I saw the price drop.

Now, gun prices can be geographical. But, that's what they cost here. Now, U can't get that price IN a gun shop. Just the shows.
 

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CHICAGO TYPEWRITER said:
Last question, what is better, Italian made or USA made Beretta?
HOnestly - it doesn't matter.

I'd recommend a stainless (called "Inox") - the finish is more durable. Other than that, it doesn't matter.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Brigidier? I really don't know the difference in this one.
92 CV? Accessory Rail on bottom?
92 FS? I belive this the Orginal
92-Two? I don't think I like the 90-Two. Plastic wrap grip and Accsory rail?

Does this sum it up? Beretta has a crapy site and you can't order catalogs.

Ship, are you sure the $409 was new? I'm having a very hard time finding somehing under $500 here new.

CX4 storm was on sale for $450. I was tempted but I lile metal so I'm going to pass on this. Beside I'm sucker for McClaine's orginal!
 

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CHICAGO TYPEWRITER said:
Brigidier? I really don't know the difference in this one.
92 CV? Accessory Rail on bottom?
92 FS? I belive this the Orginal
92-Two? I don't think I like the 90-Two. Plastic wrap grip and Accsory rail?

Does this sum it up? Beretta has a crapy site and you can't order catalogs.

Ship, are you sure the $409 was new? I'm having a very hard time finding somehing under $500 here new.

CX4 storm was on sale for $450. I was tempted but I lile metal so I'm going to pass on this. Beside I'm sucker for McClaine's orginal!
The Bridier has a slightly different slide - a bit hicker around the locking block. The 92FS is essentially the orriginal. Years and years ago, there was a 92F, but the 92FS is the current base model. U can buy the M9 now with the same grip and with a rail. It's very similiar to the 92SD that was out a coulple of years ago (the SD had a blackened stainless slide and barrel and had the rail on the old style grip). Then, there is the Vertec, which has the rail and the new grip.

Yes, I am sure those are new prices. I have seen them at several shows at several vendor tables. But, like I said, U won't find it that price at the gunstore.

At a store, I don't think I'd pay more than $475 - 500 if I had no way to find one at the show price.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I'm leaning to the 90-two. I like the grips on the vertex but I like the sits much better on the 90-two. Does anyone make a soft rubber grip for the 90-two yet?
 

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No, there are no aftermarket grips for the 90-Two yet. Heck, they never made any Hogue grips for the Vertec. Someone on the Beretta Forum was modifying the regular ones and selling them to fit on the vertec.
 

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i think the biggest difference between italian and US is that the Italian's mag release maybe on the bottom of the pistol grip instead of near the trigger guard. thats a common european thing.
 

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LOWMANJASON said:
i think the biggest difference between italian and US is that the Italian's mag release maybe on the bottom of the pistol grip instead of near the trigger guard. thats a common european thing.
There is no 92FS with a eurostyle mag release that I have ever seen.

The Euro 92s are the same as the American ones for the most part.
 
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