[agauos]

Hi,

I'm looking into putting a silencer on the Scar 20s, I just need to know if the parts below will work on it and what everyone's opinion is on this particular suppressor.

Also is there anything else I need to know besides just swapping the flash hider and putting on the suppressor?

Dead Air Flash Hider (5/8 x 24 for Scar 17)

Flash Hider – DeadAirSilencers

Dead Air Sandman-L

Sandman-L – DeadAirSilencers

 

[archmark]

Hi,

I'm looking into putting a silencer on the Scar 20s, I just need to know if the parts below will work on it and what everyone's opinion is on this particular suppressor.

Also is there anything else I need to know besides just swapping the flash hider and putting on the suppressor?

Dead Air Flash Hider (5/8 x 24 for Scar 17)

Flash Hider – DeadAirSilencers

Dead Air Sandman-L

Sandman-L – DeadAirSilencers

Watch the video that Jarod at Parker Mountain Machine put out. It's the DEFINATIVE answer to your question (but you may or may not like hearing what he has to say about a particular brand of suppressor)...

 

[agauos]

Very helpful and informative. Thanks. Looks like the Dead Airs are good to go.

 

[ifspring]

Hi,

I'm looking into putting a silencer on the Scar 20s, I just need to know if the parts below will work on it and what everyone's opinion is on this particular suppressor.

Also is there anything else I need to know besides just swapping the flash hider and putting on the suppressor?

Dead Air Flash Hider (5/8 x 24 for Scar 17)

Flash Hider – DeadAirSilencers

Dead Air Sandman-L

Sandman-L – DeadAirSilencers

I would put a cgs Hyperion suppressor on 20s. It is specially designed for precision rifle. Has been very impressive on my petra 300 win mag AR.

 

[ducZOAS]

I've been trying to decide what suppressor to get for my 20S for a few weeks and finally made up my mind and have one on order. I was deciding between Dead Air, OSS, and SureFire. Suppressor selection is so subjective and quality test data is hard to come by. Everyone has their own requirements so mine probably differ from yours (and this may be totally irrelevant) but wanted to share in case you hadn't researched all these options.

This recent Pew Science review was the largest deciding factors in going SureFire over Dead Air. I like the quick detach on the Dead Air better than the SureFire. The deciding factor for me was the incredibly low back pressure on the SureFire SOCOM 762-RC2 with no sound penalty over a Dead Air Sandman-L (Figure 13).

Surefire SOCOM762-RC2 .308 Suppressor Test — PEW Science

Surefire SOCOM762-RC2 Silencer Test with back pressure data. Real sound signature data with the Suppression Rating from PEW Science. Hearing Safe determinations for your use case. How does it do as a 308 rifle suppressor? Can it suppress 7.62 NATO? Is it the best 308 hunting suppressor?

pewscience.com

I'm watching the PMM video as I type this but I'd imagine the SCAR can be tuned to run nearly any suppressor. I like the fact that the SureFire should not require any tuning for those times when you're running without a suppressor in addition to a host of other benefits of lower back pressure. The really interesting takeaway I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else is the SureFire performs terribly with the SureFire Warcomp flash hider. Many previous reviewers that were critical of the high SPL numbers on the SureFire suppressor were running the Warcomp so take their numbers with a grain of salt.

 

[thehun]

Surefire is the gold standard for sure...

 

[agauos]

I've been trying to decide what suppressor to get for my 20S for a few weeks and finally made up my mind and have one on order. I was deciding between Dead Air, OSS, and SureFire. Suppressor selection is so subjective and quality test data is hard to come by. Everyone has their own requirements so mine probably differ from yours (and this may be totally irrelevant) but wanted to share in case you hadn't researched all these options.

This recent Pew Science review was the largest deciding factors in going SureFire over Dead Air. I like the quick detach on the Dead Air better than the SureFire. The deciding factor for me was the incredibly low back pressure on the SureFire SOCOM 762-RC2 with no sound penalty over a Dead Air Sandman-L (Figure 13).

Surefire SOCOM762-RC2 .308 Suppressor Test — PEW Science

Surefire SOCOM762-RC2 Silencer Test with back pressure data. Real sound signature data with the Suppression Rating from PEW Science. Hearing Safe determinations for your use case. How does it do as a 308 rifle suppressor? Can it suppress 7.62 NATO? Is it the best 308 hunting suppressor?

pewscience.com

I'm watching the PMM video as I type this but I'd imagine the SCAR can be tuned to run nearly any suppressor. I like the fact that the SureFire should not require any tuning for those times when you're running without a suppressor in addition to a host of other benefits of lower back pressure. The really interesting takeaway I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else is the SureFire performs terribly with the SureFire Warcomp flash hider. Many previous reviewers that were critical of the high SPL numbers on the SureFire suppressor were running the Warcomp so take their numbers with a grain of salt.

After my post I did more digging and actually came to the same conclusion to just go with Surefire. Now I'm stuck deciding between the Mini2 and the SOCOM 762-RC2. On one hand I want as little back pressure from the suppressor as possible, but on the other hand I want the suppressor to actually supress. I'll probably go with the 762-RC2 though.

 

[ducZOAS]

This thread is worth reading if you haven't already. I don't know if everything that's said is true but it was enough to convince me to avoid the mini.

Surefire SOCOM 762-RC2 vs. 762-Mini2 - AR15.COM

Firearm Discussion and Resources from AR-15, AK-47, Handguns and more! Buy, Sell, and Trade your Firearms and Gear.

www.ar15.com

I have a 762 mini 2. It's really meant for 7.62x39, not 7.62x51.

With 5.56 it is very loud. More moderator than suppressor. It takes the edge off but that's about it.

I currently use it on a scar 17 and have also run it on my lmt mws. A couple of my friends have 762 RCs and RC2s and those are a much better way to go for the slight increase in weight and significantly better sound reduction.

Really the only thing going for the mini 2 is the extremely low back pressure. My dead air sandman s and saker 762 are sooooo much more pleasant across all calibers.

 

[agauos]

This thread is worth reading if you haven't already. I don't know if everything that's said is true but it was enough to convince me to avoid the mini.

Surefire SOCOM 762-RC2 vs. 762-Mini2 - AR15.COM

Firearm Discussion and Resources from AR-15, AK-47, Handguns and more! Buy, Sell, and Trade your Firearms and Gear.

www.ar15.com

I did happen across that thread! The comment about the extremely low back pressure was what put it on the table for me, but I do think I'm going to go with the RC2. Also I forgot to mention before, but in regards to your previous comment about the WARCOMP flash hider, it seems that the regular old 3-prong does the job. Is that the one you're going with? The muzzle break seems like a decent option too.

 

[archmark]

I did happen across that thread! The comment about the extremely low back pressure was what put it on the table for me, but I do think I'm going to go with the RC2. Also I forgot to mention before, but in regards to your previous comment about the WARCOMP flash hider, it seems that the regular old 3-prong does the job. Is that the one you're going with? The muzzle break seems like a decent option too.

Good choice on selecting the SF SOCOM RC2. It's really the ONLY suppressor manufactirer chosen by SOCOM for the previous 9 years, so that should help when making your decision. The Poor's will complain that the SF SOCOM RC2 is not the quietest suppressor, which is correct, but quietness WAS NOT the determining factor in the design specified by SOCOM. "TOTAL SIGNATURE REDUCTION" was the design criteria demanded by Uncle Sucker and only Surefire met the requirement. To find out what "TOTAL SIGNATURE REDUCTION" is, go to the Surefire website for an explanation. It's not the imaginary "Pew-Pew Hollywood Quiet" that some off brand suppressor owners falsely claim that their inferior cans provide. They're BS artists who regred their original poor suppressor selections. Prepare for the Poors & Haters to give you a ration for choosing Surefire, but just remember that all the other guys are still just L-O-S-E-R-S!!!

 

[SeaMac]

Good choice on selecting the SF SOCOM RC2. It's really the ONLY suppressor manufactirer chosen by SOCOM for the previous 9 years, so that should help when making your decision. The Poor's will complain that the SF SOCOM RC2 is not the quietest suppressor, which is correct, but quietness WAS NOT the determining factor in the design specified by SOCOM. "TOTAL SIGNATURE REDUCTION" was the design criteria demanded by Uncle Sucker and only Surefire met the requirement. To find out what "TOTAL SIGNATURE REDUCTION" is, go to the Surefire website for an explanation. It's not the imaginary "Pew-Pew Hollywood Quiet" that some off brand suppressor owners falsely claim that their inferior cans provide. They're BS artists who regred their original poor suppressor selections. Prepare for the Poors & Haters to give you a ration for choosing Surefire, but just remember that all the other guys are still just L-O-S-E-R-S!!!

Once again demonstrating just how little knowledge of firearms you have and even less about USSOCOM. If you took a minute or two out of what must be a super busy life and looked up NSN's you'd discover PLENTY of suppressor manufacturers are approved by SOCOM.

Clearly you know less than zero about SOCOM or how some of it's SMU's are allowed to "kit up". I suspect you never were in the service, as a veteran I find it somewhat insulting and disrespectful that you refer to the US Military as Uncle Sucker.

 

[archmark]

Once again demonstrating just how little knowledge of firearms you have and even less about USSOCOM. If you took a minute or two out of what must be a super busy life and looked up NSN's you'd discover PLENTY of suppressor manufacturers are approved by SOCOM.

Clearly you know less than zero about SOCOM or how some of it's SMU's are allowed to "kit up". I suspect you never were in the service, as a veteran I find it somewhat insulting and disrespectful that you refer to the US Military as Uncle Sucker.

SeaMac, deep breaths Rambo. Your Guard unit is drilling next weekend so you can go play warfighter again soon Sport...

 

[SeaMac]

SeaMac, deep breaths Rambo. Your Guard unit is drilling next weekend so you can go play warfighter again soon Sport...

Nah, way too old for Guard. However, I'd be happy to bring my air boat back to life if you'd like to go for a ride in the Everglades, Sport?

 

[agauos]

Once again demonstrating just how little knowledge of firearms you have and even less about USSOCOM. If you took a minute or two out of what must be a super busy life and looked up NSN's you'd discover PLENTY of suppressor manufacturers are approved by SOCOM.

Clearly you know less than zero about SOCOM or how some of it's SMU's are allowed to "kit up". I suspect you never were in the service, as a veteran I find it somewhat insulting and disrespectful that you refer to the US Military as Uncle Sucker.

For what it's worth, thank you for your service. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the topic at hand.

 

[SeaMac]

For what it's worth, thank you for your service. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the topic at hand.

Honestly, I'd give the guys at Silencer Shop a call. Tell them what you're looking for and your budget. Surefire is one of many SOCOM approved vendors, they do make excellent suppressors and so do others. Buy what meets your technical and budgetary needs.

 

[ducZOAS]

I did happen across that thread! The comment about the extremely low back pressure was what put it on the table for me, but I do think I'm going to go with the RC2. Also I forgot to mention before, but in regards to your previous comment about the WARCOMP flash hider, it seems that the regular old 3-prong does the job. Is that the one you're going with? The muzzle break seems like a decent option too.

Funny you ask...I was going through the flash hider vs muzzle brake debate last week and decided to go with the muzzle brake and a SureFire Warden (while I wait for the suppressor stamp) to redirect sound if needed. The muzzle brake was not tested (see question below) so it's not clear whether it will perform well or not since the muzzle brake has sort of a mix of the flash hider and warcomp's features.

In the Pew Science review it was deduced that the significant leakage from the suppressor/warcomp interface could be due to the porting (radial holes near the tapered surface) and/or the lack of labyrinth seals. The only sealing interface when using a warcomp is the tapered surface. The flash hider has labyrinth seals but no porting. The muzzle brake has labyrinth seals but also a small amount of porting (much less than the warcomp). None of these designs are going to seal perfectly at 2-5ksi but the warcomp is missing crucial features that improve the sealing drastically.

It never occurred to me prior to reading the review (it's always obvious in hindsight) but now that it has been brought to light it's quite obvious why the warcomp performs poorly. I'm actually surprised SureFire doesn't recommend avoiding the warcomp. Then again, it's a poor design and shouldn't have ever been manufactured as a suppressor interface. After studying the designs I'm guessing (and I'll let you know in 200-300 days) the muzzle brake will perform close to as well the flash hider with a small penalty due to the porting. The design of the muzzle brake sealing interface is far superior to that of the warcomp.

My question:

Do you have any plans to test the with the SureFire muzzle brake? It would be my first choice over the 3-prong flash hider but seems like a gamble without any test data. In your review you note that the warcomp has both porting and lacks the labyrinth seals found on the 3-prong flash hider. The SureFire muzzle brake is also ported (significantly less than the warcomp) but has the labyrinth seals. So, it really depends whether the ineffectiveness of the warcomp is due to the ports or the lack of labyrinth seals however this is definitely not an easy thing to answer.​

Response from Owner of PEW Science:

... I need to do that test. Seems like a good test to do and an important test, at that. Currently, I would only use non-ported Surefire muzzle devices when suppressed, to be safe, but I do realize that is not an option or desired by everyone. I think the gas leakage is exacerbated by the ports.​

​

​

Sorry for the long winded answer to your simple question. I've been researching this for a few days straight and I felt I should write it all down before I forget why the hell I chose the muzzle brake. PS if you buy any of the 3 SureFire brakes you don't need to buy a PMM or KBA shoulder washer assuming you have the older stepped barrel like I do. It's all included but make sure you read the instructions for direction of the chamfer!

 

[GhostRecon21]

I run a Sandman S on my 17S without issue. The rifle makes a great host.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[agauos]

Funny you ask...I was going through the flash hider vs muzzle brake debate last week and decided to go with the muzzle brake and a SureFire Warden (while I wait for the suppressor stamp) to redirect sound if needed. The muzzle brake was not tested (see question below) so it's not clear whether it will perform well or not since the muzzle brake has sort of a mix of the flash hider and warcomp's features.

In the Pew Science review it was deduced that the significant leakage from the suppressor/warcomp interface could be due to the porting (radial holes near the tapered surface) and/or the lack of labyrinth seals. The only sealing interface when using a warcomp is the tapered surface. The flash hider has labyrinth seals but no porting. The muzzle brake has labyrinth seals but also a small amount of porting (much less than the warcomp). None of these designs are going to seal perfectly at 2-5ksi but the warcomp is missing crucial features that improve the sealing drastically.

It never occurred to me prior to reading the review (it's always obvious in hindsight) but now that it has been brought to light it's quite obvious why the warcomp performs poorly. I'm actually surprised SureFire doesn't recommend avoiding the warcomp. Then again, it's a poor design and shouldn't have ever been manufactured as a suppressor interface. After studying the designs I'm guessing (and I'll let you know in 200-300 days) the muzzle brake will perform close to as well the flash hider with a small penalty due to the porting. The design of the muzzle brake sealing interface is far superior to that of the warcomp.

​

​

Sorry for the long winded answer to your simple question. I've been researching this for a few days straight and I felt I should write it all down before I forget why the hell I chose the muzzle brake. PS if you buy any of the 3 SureFire brakes you don't need to buy a PMM or KBA shoulder washer assuming you have the older stepped barrel like I do. It's all included but make sure you read the instructions for direction of the chamfer!

Interesting info, I appreciate the response. I got my 20s pretty recently and haven't taken off the muzzle device, so I was planning to get the PMM shoulder washer just in case. You're saying it's not needed?

 

[ducZOAS]

Good choice on selecting the SF SOCOM RC2. It's really the ONLY suppressor manufactirer chosen by SOCOM for the previous 9 years, so that should help when making your decision. The Poor's will complain that the SF SOCOM RC2 is not the quietest suppressor, which is correct, but quietness WAS NOT the determining factor in the design specified by SOCOM. "TOTAL SIGNATURE REDUCTION" was the design criteria demanded by Uncle Sucker and only Surefire met the requirement. To find out what "TOTAL SIGNATURE REDUCTION" is, go to the Surefire website for an explanation. It's not the imaginary "Pew-Pew Hollywood Quiet" that some off brand suppressor owners falsely claim that their inferior cans provide. They're BS artists who regred their original poor suppressor selections. Prepare for the Poors & Haters to give you a ration for choosing Surefire, but just remember that all the other guys are still just L-O-S-E-R-S!!!

Do you have a RC2, ideally on a SCAR? If so what QD mount are you running?

Honestly, I'd give the guys at Silencer Shop a call. Tell them what you're looking for and your budget. Surefire is one of many SOCOM approved vendors, they do make excellent suppressors and so do others. Buy what meets your technical and budgetary needs.

I would have loved to have supported Silencer Shop since I've spent so many hours going through their extremely helpful website to select a suppressor. Unfortunately they were out of stock on the RC2 and couldn't provide any estimate on when they might get more. It took some work to find one in stock but they're out there if you look. Also some places have them on sale for $1069 so try not to pay $1400.

 

[ducZOAS]

Interesting info, I appreciate the response. I got my 20s pretty recently and haven't taken off the muzzle device, so I was planning to get the PMM shoulder washer just in case. You're saying it's not needed?

The shoulder washer kit that PMM sells is the exact same kit that's included with the SureFire muzzle devices. I received my SureFire muzzle brake (SFMB-762-5/8-24) today and can confirm it includes the chamfered washer plus an assortment of timing shims. Same as what's for sale in this link:

Surefire Shim Kit, SF3P / SFMB / Warcomp-762, 5/8-24

Check out the deal on Surefire Shim Kit, SF3P / SFMB / Warcomp-762, 5/8-24 at MGW

www.midwestgunworks.com

Is your Scar the original design with the stepped 1:12" barrel and 3-prong flash hider or the redesign with the non-stepped 1:10" barrel and muzzle brake? There is a ton of misinformation and dangerous advice floating around the internet on this so please read the instructions and do as it says. Both PMM and SureFire have decent videos on YouTube but they tend to gloss over the most critical step.

If you have the stepped 1:12" barrel:
On page 3 it says "Note: With SCAR-H, use supplied spacer with chamfer facing away from shoulder." This confuses people because every other rifle calls for the chamfer to be facing the shoulder to act as a relief for the small radius that always exists at the bottom of the threads. If this same orientation is used on the Scar then the washer will have very minimal surface contact or possibly clamp on the chamfered surface (the chamfer OD is very close in size to the barrel OD but I haven't taken measurements). Regardless, the correct method is to flip the washer around like the manual says.

https://www.surefire.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/71-01-997_Suppressor-Adapter-Installation_Rev-C.pdf

SureFire should make this more explicit but they clearly haven't updated their manual since FN decided to change the dimensions of the barrel. I've seen a handful of people say they disregarded that advice because they thought it must be a misprint and that, to me, is a very bad idea.

If you have the non-stepped 1:10" barrel:
I'd imagine (but have not confirmed) the washer should be installed the standard way where the chamfer faces the shoulder. The chamfered washer may not even be necessary depending on the thread depth of the flash hider and threaded length of the barrel. You don't want the tip of the barrel threads to bottom out inside the flash hider of you'll be locating the muzzle device off the incorrect surface. I have not seen these in person so don't take my word for it.