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Discussion Starter #1
I don't now if you'll are following the whole spending thing, but I find it interesting that we are spending $180 billion a year in Iraq of which 85 to 90 billion go to CONTRACTORS. Some contractors are making $1,300 a day and somehow (funny math) that is the cheaper than having a Sgt on active duty do this job. Last I checked the daily norm for a SGT is around $43.00 a day.

The Iraqis have 80 billion in New York banks from oil money, and I seem to remember that someone said that Iraqs oil would pay for the War. Whats up with that?

Now we are bailing out Fanny May and Freddy Mac at a cost of $200 billion to the tax payers.

Now what is conservative about this situation?
 

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Well, for one, it'd cost a whole lot more to feed and house all the homeless people who lose their house soon because some stupid people made bad loans. Either way, the tax payer would be strained, unfortunately.

Zhur
 

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It amazes me that that many people would sign those loans. Either they had no choice or they were just too ignorant to know any better. And the shortt sightedness of the lenders. Did no one contemplate what would happen when all those loans defaulted?

Last year when I purchased some land, before all this started happening, I contacted 5 different banks to finance it.

Three of them did not even offer fixed rate loans. No joke. Of the two that did offer fixed rate loans, one said he was sure they did but he had no idea what interest rate it would be so he would have to ask his boss and call me back.

The last bank (Wells Fargo) the lady there admitted they had them but no one ever asked for them. She was perplexed that I even asked. She said the variable rate was only 4% interest and the fixed was 8%.

WF: "Why would you want to pay twice the interest?"

Me: "How long is the 4% garanteed for?"

WF: "Two years."

Me: "And what wil it go to after that?"

WF: "Oh, we never know, just whatever the going rate is at the time."

Me: "I'll take the 8% please."

Does anyone know what interest rate all these people are getting hit with? I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere.

My wife and I know a family in California that had to let their house go because they signed a varible rate mortgage. I don't know what interest rate they got stuck with but their house payment more than tripled. There was no way they could pay it.

There is a young guy here at work that I just have to shake my head at. He is 20 years old and has no credit at all. I put him in charge of the receiving dept and he makes a nice paycheck now. Well, he wants to get a new car since he has the money now.

I tell him to "...wait a year, go down to a jewelry store and buy a 200 watch and ask them to start you a charge account. Then go to another one and buy a ring or chain or something. Make your payments on time and pay just a little over the minimum. In fact start one at Radio Shack or other store, maybe JC Penny's. The payments will be so small you won't miss the money. And the amount is so low the hefty interest won't kill you. The trick is to make SMALL purchases, don't rack up huge debt.

After a year go apply for a car loan at a dealership. If they offer a good low rate, then go for it. If it's over 10% wait anothe 6 months and try again."

He didn't listen, that raise was buning a hole in his pocket. If I remember right, he went to a used car lot, (a relative works there) he was sold a Jeep with 60,000 miles on it, for 7000 dollars at 20% interest. Now his girlfriend is prego, he has this huge car payment, and can't sell the Jeep for what he ows on it. :roll:
 

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If you ask me, the source of the whole thing is...........


Personal
Financial
Irresponsability
of
PEOPLE

Short and simple.

People just HAD to:

--finance to the hilt with no money down,
--over buy a house they couldn't afford
--depended on their stock going up 20% a year
--rolll credit card and other irresponsible debt into their mortgage
--lease the absolute most expensive car they could afford
--overborrow on the NEXT home just like they did on the first one
etc.

Sure there are exceptions where people had serious financial downturns, but shouldn't we all SPEND responsibly so we have an emergency fun to turn a rough corner in our lives?

Financial irresponsability if you ask me. That is what this is.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I agree that people made some really "f"ed up choices, but the banks also "f"ed up. Giving a loan to a guy so he can buy a $150,000 house that works at the tasty freeze making $18,000 a year and has no other assets is stupid. You know damn well his going to defalt. Now thats fine, let him defalt and let the bank also take in the shorts for making the stupid loan. I say nobody gets bailed out. Let them all swing.

I just don't understand why conservatives would want to bail out bad business practices. Let those banks fail, I say. The idiots that ran these things should be in the poor house.
 

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devildoc,

I guess I don't understand what you are missing? Lets say that you have a loan at a bank, and you also have money at the bank, and all the retards have big fat loans at the same bank... guess what... you may not have made a bad decision, but you are still going to pay the price when they close your bank!

It's not about conservatives wanting to spend money, it's about making sure you and I and the millions of other smart money people don't lose everything we have. Banks have Federal Insurance up to $10k per customer, but I know that I have WAY more assets than $10k thru my bank. Home, cars, savings, Bonds, CD's checking account, all gone if the banks go under.

Someone will undoubtedly say, "get a better bank", but the fact is, ALL banks are in trouble in this situation. I don't like that the Gov't is bailing them out, but I do like that my loan isn't going to be called in for immediate payment because the bank goes under, and then I lose everything I own. That'd be a bad day.

Zhur
 

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Why don't the banks just take back the deeds in lieu of motgage and resale the house? Yes, they will take a loss because the houses are not worth what they were since the market fell, but it isn't a total write off. They can't absorb the hit and get back to work with tighter lending practices?
 

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Zhurdan said:
devildoc,

... have Federal Insurance up to $10k per customer, but I know that I have WAY more assets than $10k thru my bank. Home, cars, savings, Bonds, CD's checking account, all gone ...


Zhur
The FDIC insures certain accounts for $100K not $10K.

:!:

I am tired of bailing out people who have made bad decisions concerning finances.

Damn near everyone of these bad mortgage loans that were had were by people and banks that used CREATIVE FINANCING to get the loan. They knew that they could not afford the loans so as far as I am concerned - **** off, it's not MY responsibility to bail YOUR ass out.

Now there is talk of $50 BILLION to bail out the car industry. And more talk of $25 BILLION to bail out the airline industry. $200 BILLION for Freddi Mac and Fanne May. Where does this **** end?

Any car industry that pays its top CEO's $250,000,000.00 a year and expects the US taxpayer to bail them out should have all their property and cash confiscated. Instead of looking for the taxpayer to bail them out, let the CEO's pay the money back before you even attempt to get money from me to bail YOUR ass out due to YOUR mismanagement of YOUR financial status.

Let all these Frakers go bankrupt and out of buisness.

We have become a nation of whinny assed little ****s that want to suck off the teat of the taxpayer.

:!:

Sorry about the language but I am just really pissed off about paying out the ass for all these bailouts.
 

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Any car industry that pays its top CEO's $250,000,000.00 a year and expects the US taxpayer to bail them out should have all their property and cash confiscated.
Execellent idea, liquidate all his assets and the assets of every company officer. These CEO's and politicians are not held accountable for their actions. It needs to change.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I'm with you HK SD9 Tactical, to hell with bailing these billionaires out. If I went under no one in comgress would bail me out. Nor would I expect them to. If I get myself into crap, than its my job to get myself out, or die trying.

I say that everyone that was involved, that includes those that made money on these stupid loan deals and those that took out the stupid loans should be on the streets. Total stupidity should not be rewarded.

Also I beleave that FDIC insures regular acconuts up to $100,000 and IRA's up to $250,000.
 

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the only one to blame is greed

on the sub contractor thing, I said years ago it was stupid to downsize the military. under my plan we would centralize purchasing and payroll but use smaller local bases, that can be multi use an serve the local community as well as the military. I would have this mini bases around critical infrastructure as a way to protect it. Also instead of welfare I would use workfare were military housing would be better then housing for those on welfare. if you are collecting welfare you will be doing something constructive to help out. I got more but typing on this laptop stinks
 

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I'm related to a bank examiner for the FDIC and can confirm the 100k insurance, and they actually give a percentage of the remainder if the assets are over 100k. He was with the FDIC all through the Savings and Loan crisis before and says we'll make it through this one too. It's all caused by greed and corruption from both those that give loans and those that take loans. We like to think that we as American's are less corrupt than other countries, and maybe we are to some degree, but we still have our own problems dealing with it.
 

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Kind of reminds me of the "paying to much for your whistle" post earlier in the week. There's the idiot that pays too much for something he/she thinks they have to have right now and the greedy SOB who's more than happy to take their money for it.
 

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The specific impetus came from Andrew Cuomo in 1997 when at HUD he took off lending caps and allowed for no downpayment and no doc loans and let it be known that anyone turning down low income applicants might be subject to DOJ suit for "redlining". If you want to know the real cause of this mess (political/government meddling via HUD and Fannie/Freddie in free markets for loan origination) there was a good summary article in the Wall Street Journal yesterday.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Doesn't the Wall Street Journal run ads for Merrill Lynch, AIG and all those other failed banks, Oops, I mean Investment Agencies. Banks actually have deposits.

I think all these Investment Agencies should fall under the Nevada gaming commission, cuz it's all just plan old gambling.

I just saw the the fed is going to bail out AIG insurance agency to the tune of a $85 billion loan. Now how is that legal? and, What happens if they don't pay it back? I say screw AIG, Fannie/Freddie and the rest, freeze all their accounts, chop them up and sell them off.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I got a serious question now that the FED owns 80% of AIG. If the Fed raises rates (Part of their job to fight inflation) and it hurts the intrest in AIG, or keeps down intrest rates artificually to increase the value in AIG isn't that a conflict of intrest? I didn't think that a federal agency could own a private insurance agency.
 
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