FNP-9 trigger group crack

28129 Views 71 Replies 30 Participants Last post by glocksonlock, Jun 30, 2014

FNHC

Discussion Starter · Dec 9, 2007

3

Got this about 4 weeks ago and so far had 160 rounds of American Eagle 115gr 9mm. After latest session of 50 rounds, I decided to clean it, and found this crack. To say that I'm disappointed is an understatement. This is the first time I ever see a frame crack like this in any of the guns I own. To add insult to the injury, it was only 160 rounds

I know of this problem in some .40S&W versions, but in a 9mm?

From looks of it, seems like stress fracture. I'm wodering if this would be due to the way that part of gun is made. On the otherside, there is a metal frame where the pin goes through, but on the right handside, there isn't one.

I'll be calling FNH USA sometime this week to get it fixed. One thing that is kind of confusing me is the way in which they want it shipped

4-Package it securely in a double-packed cardboard container.

What is a double packed cardboard container? I'm planning to pack the pistol inside the original case(without other things like 2 extra magazines) and then put it in a FED-Ex box. I wonder if that is what they mean be that.

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PX4 Storm

· #2 · Dec 10, 2007

They want you to double box it.

I wouldn't send it in the original case- it's just something for them to lose. Put the gun, wrapped in bubble wrap, in a small box, and put that box inside another box.

Too bad about the frame crack. In my book, this is a problem with the FNP series of handguns and is making me rethink the possibility of my buying one. I'm quite happy with my Five-seveN, but I think I'm going to wait on the FNP.

I hope they get it taken care of for you. At least you'll get a new frame out of the deal.

PX4

ironman0311

· #3 · Dec 11, 2007

These type posts (parts failure, broken or guns that will not fire at all, after only a few rounds fired, etc.) are occurring here, and on other gunboards, with what to me appears an alarming frequency.

I sure hope FNH would put out some official information on what they are doing to correct it. (And, the other problems reported in this section.I.E cracked frames, weak mag springs, etc.)

Specifically, if these are truly design flaws as some have alleged in the general FNP discussion area, or a result of a batch of a bad, and, or, out of spec parts run.

I REALLY want to buy one of these guns, but posts like these have me too spooked to do so.

Seems a LOT of folks are having to return these guns to the factory. More-so than any other new model run out guns that I can recall in a long while.

I STILL do not know what he factory is doing to make them right?

Can any of you guys post what they actually did to correct any problems you had with your guns? How long were you without your gun? Was the process easy, hard? Any cost to you for shipping?

The silence on the 'issues' with the FNP series (and any causes and fixes) from FNH is deafening.

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Rugerdude

· #4 · Dec 17, 2007

My FNP-9 did the exact same thing after something less than 300 rounds of factory ammo. I liked the gun a lot, but that was incredibly dissapointing. On the plus side, it doesn't seem to be a problem as long as you use it in single-action only, it's the double-action that makes it FTF when the frame cracks.

The store that I bought it from was very helpful in getting it sent back though and I will probabbly buy more guns from them in the future.

I believe they sent it back 5 weeks ago, and on a prior phone call to FNUSA they said that the time at the factory was about 3 weeks for repairs.

I do not have my gun back yet, but the store might have gotten it back and not been able to reache me due to massive power outages in my area.

I'll give it a chance when it comes back, but that Taurus PT-92 is looking awfully tempting.... If the store will buy it back from me at a decent price, then I might just say goodbye to my FNP.

garn

· #5 · Dec 17, 2007

I have only seen a few posts on this subject, and you should probably believe that if it happens to ANYONE, they would post it on the first FN forum they find.

So, IMO, there are probably few cases of this happening, could be a bad batch of guns?

I have about 1,000+ rnds through my FNP9 and not a single malfunction or problem.

PX4 Storm

· #6 · Dec 17, 2007

I'd bet that the VAST, VAST majority of FNP owners don't even know that this forum exists, let alone post reports of their problems to it. I think the trigger group crack is a serious problem and has happened enough so that FNH is aware that there is probably a design flaw.

I have had conversations with FNH-USA representatives about this issue that lead me to believe that a frame redesign is underway, or has already been undertaken. I WILL NOT divulge who I talked to or exactly what leads me to believe this, because the question was not answered directly nor for public consumption.

It'll be interesting to see if the "Dark Earth" FNPs have the same frame design...

I have only seen a few posts on this subject, and you should probably believe that if it happens to ANYONE, they would post it on the first FN forum they find.

So, IMO, there are probably few cases of this happening, could be a bad batch of guns?

I have about 1,000+ rnds through my FNP9 and not a single malfunction or problem.

ironman0311

· #7 · Dec 18, 2007

Which is why I have been clamoring for FNH to address this issues and the others with us, straight forwardly and in PUBLIC, on this board or another venue, or by mailing the owners and dealers.

Anything less, is rank disrespect for their customers, and potential customers, saftey.

So let's have FNH, what is going on with these guns, why, and, what are you doing to correct it? These are not questions you can avoid answering any longer.

Tell us the serial number range that these problems exist so we can avoid buying them until you get the revisions are in place. And, if one is unfortunate to own one of the 'bad' ones in that range, advise them to stop shooting it them, issue a call tag for it to be replaced with updated parts or a new gun. THAT would do much to enhancing credibility and PR and be the responsible action.

Not wait until some unwary person gets killed, or injured, as the result of a faulty firearm!

Should someone be injured as a result of your silence their lawyers would have a field-day with you; as these threads (I am sure they have been cut and pasted by someone.) would serve as evidence you had prior knowledge your product had defects and you refused to advise your customers and public though apprised of them and asked to do so repeatedly.

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garn

· #8 · Dec 18, 2007

I examined mine again REAL closely, it looks like on the left side the steel pin is reinforced with a steel or aluminum insert that fits inside the polymer hammer assembly. On the right side however it is just polymer.

What I see that is IMO the issue on SOME of these guns, is that there is a casting line/mark right next to the pin, which is where all of these appear to be cracking. It goes straight up to the top from the front of the pin location.

Another thing I notice, comparing your pictures with my FNP, is that the polymer hammer assembly on yours seems to have a rough-like texture to it, whereas mine is very smooth, but the fiberglass strands are sort of visible on the surface. I don't know if they changed production methods on this part or what because for the first year of owning my FNP this issue was nonexistant, and I have one of the earlier 'all black' models (the controls all black, no silver. So that could be a possibility.

I don't know if the pins are oversized or the holes undersized or if its just this casting mark that is causing stress to be located to the surface on this point causing the cracks, but thats what I see.

IMO, I think they should have used steel or aluminum for the rear hammer assembly/housing thing.

With over 1,000 rounds, I have not had a SINGLE issue with my FNP however, and hope it stays that way!

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kcdano

· #9 · Dec 18, 2007

i think i will go tear my gun down and look real close.

ironman0311

· #10 · Dec 23, 2007

Wonder if that Texturing is a contributing factor to these frames cracking???

Maybe some sort of flaw in the mixing of the particular polymer batch prior to mold process?

garn

· #11 · Dec 26, 2007

Wonder if that Texturing is a contributing factor to these frames cracking???

Maybe some sort of flaw in the mixing of the particular polymer batch prior to mold process?

Very well could be. On a stressed part, if there are ridges or a texture, the stresses will tend to gather on the ridges or casting marks and cause a fracture, instead of being distributed evenly across the surface. This is why people shot-peen connecting rods in engines, for example

lastmanstanding

· #12 · Dec 27, 2007

As I mentioned in the other thread about this same issue only with the FNP 40's. My FNP 9 showed up with the same exact problem. I downloaded the return form at FNH web site and filled it out. In the comment section of the form I told them to visit this forum for pictures and descriptions of others with this same problem. I sent it Fed Ex overnight to them yesterday so they should have it today. Perhaps someone from FNH will visit this board and comment on the issue.
I don't view this as a indicator that FNP is putting out a inferior product. It gives them the opportunity to show us what level of customer service they can provide. They have a issue with a new product and they will fix it. Not that unusual. I have no buyers regret what so ever.

ironman0311

· #13 · Jan 20, 2008

PX4 Storm said:
I'd bet that the VAST, VAST majority of FNP owners don't even know that this forum exists, let alone post reports of their problems to it. I think the trigger group crack is a serious problem and has happened enough so that FNH is aware that there is probably a design flaw.

I have had conversations with FNH-USA representatives about this issue that lead me to believe that a frame redesign is underway, or has already been undertaken. I WILL NOT divulge who I talked to or exactly what leads me to believe this, because the question was not answered directly nor for public consumption.

It'll be interesting to see if the "Dark Earth" FNPs have the same frame design...

I have only seen a few posts on this subject, and you should probably believe that if it happens to ANYONE, they would post it on the first FN forum they find.

So, IMO, there are probably few cases of this happening, could be a bad batch of guns?

I have about 1,000+ rnds through my FNP9 and not a single malfunction or problem.

Click to expand...

ANY more info on the" frame redisgn" and when it's supposed to take place?

Texas Armadillo

· #14 · Jan 21, 2008

I just took mine apart to check it out and it is fine. After reading the above posts and looking at the pics by FNHC that show where the crack starts, I wonder if it could be a combination of the pin stressing the plastic right where a seem or line is. Here is the pic by FNHC... (by the way, this pic looks like the plastic was exposed to excess heat I wonder if that is an issue)

What I mean is, if that pin is a tight fit, that plastic is under some stress. On mine, there is a 'line' or 'seem' in the plastic that runs right to the edge of that pin hole. That line is right where the crack is in the pics that were posted. In fact, there is not only a line but there is a little v-notch in the plastic at the top of that piece of plastic.

When the hammer falls it impacts the metal pieces, the metal pieces are on the pin, the pin is in the plastic, if the plastic is under stress because the pin is too big, and/or the mag is out, the plastic cracks where the pin goes thru the plastic... right where line/seem is. (I'm just speculating here of course)

In aircraft, holes drilled in parts are inspected carefully. No sharp corners or scratches are allowed near holes. Stress over time can turn those sharp corners or lines into cracks causing failure of the part.

I dry-fired mine about 20 times with the slide off and mag out, watching what happens when the trigger is pulled and also what happens when the decocker is used. It appears to me that both actions put stress on that pin.

I'm not going to worry too much about it but I will make sure the mag is in it when I dry fire it or decock it.

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Fabius

· #15 · Jan 21, 2008

2

Just answered your question in the other post. My FNP-40 has the line or seam near the pinhole as you described. Don't think that the crack is necessarily related to that seam. There is a picture in another thread that shows a crack further to the rear of the assembly. That one is on the right side also. This is the picture that was posted on the other thread. You can see the seam near the pin, but the crack is much further back and seems to be unrelated to the seam.

Those are pictures of batakgt's gun posted in another thread.

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forestranger

· #16 · Jan 21, 2008

Fabius, that is exactly where my FNP9 was broke!

Fabius

· #17 · Jan 21, 2008

That is from batakgt's gun. He posted these pictures in another thread. I don't see any stress risers in that area on my gun, so it might be that the area is the part that is stressed by dry firing or decocking with the gun disassembled or without a mag.

I have dry fired quite a bit without a mag in the gun and mine is fine, so it may be a bad batch of parts or it may be the combination of dropping the hammer when the gun is disassembled and mag is out as suggested in another thread.

Texas Armadillo

· #18 · Jan 21, 2008

I think I would like to try a slightly lighter hammer spring in mine. Maybe they will offer one. I don't like that idea as a permanent solution, but I would like to try it.

Is it correct to say that we've seen 4 frames crack on the right side at the weakest point? Either starting at the pin and running up , or from a point lower in the frame that creates a crack running back and up toward the hammer?

Is there another area where someone has experienced a crack?

When I get back home tonight I'm going to check the fit of all my mags to make sure they fit tight up against that 'block' of plastic making sure it can't move forward any. I'll use the oil trick that someone here mentioned to see where the mag is giving support. If I find a mag that is not supporting that right side of the block I won't use it. And like I said earlier I won't dry-fire or decock it anymore unless a tight fitting mag is in it.

Fabius

· #19 · Jan 21, 2008

Is it correct to say that we've seen 4 frames crack on the right side at the weakest point? Either starting at the pin and running up , or from a point lower in the frame that creates a crack running back and up toward the hammer

I count 4 who have reported cracks like batakgt's, closer to the back of the frame and 1 cracked near the pin. All of the reports surfaced within a few weeks of each other late in 2007 and I haven't seen any new reports since then. That's why I was trying to get information on manufacture dates. With 40,000 guns out there, many with thousands or tens of thousands of rounds, if this were a design problem then it should have started showing up two years ago when the guns first hit the market. The posters reporting problems are experiencing them in the first few hundred rounds, so it didn't take long for the problem to surface in those guns.

I don't intend to take any special precautions other than not dropping the hammer while the gun is disassembled and I will probably keep a mag in place while dry firing, although I've dry fired a lot without a mag and haven't had a problem.

FNHC

Discussion Starter · #20 · Jan 23, 2008

Got mine back from FN today, about 4 weeks after I sent it off. I got everything I sent with them back, and a customer survey.

It seems like they replaced the trigger group part, while leaving the frame and slide intact. The texture of that part is different from what I had before as the replacement one seems to be smoother. Also, the pin was changed from the original's polymer(?) to a metal.

However there is something that kind of worries me. As you can see in the phot, there is a small straight line that runs just in front of the pin. I'll see if it holds up or not when I start firing live rounds. This is consistent with what batakgt has.
http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd138/dmaxgmc/fn2-1.jpg

Second, I have similar problem as batakgt
http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd138/dmaxgmc/FNforum.jpg
Hopefully it is not going to be a problem.

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