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Discussion Starter #1
Hi guys, need some help.

My set-up is a 17s and NF 2.5-10x in a Spuhr mount.
I want to set up a 45 degree RDS just for that 0 to 25/50 yard range.
What do you guys prefer for durability, ease of use, target acquisition...
Think first battlefield purposes and second hunting.

Aimpoint T-1 Micro or RMR-07? That is the question!
 

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^^^^ I took my offset T1micro off my SCAR to use on my Vector. Don't miss it, and I've been hunting with a 4x12 Leupold. Never had an mRDS, but they look really handy if your gonna do some 3 gun.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I found a deal on the 4moa T1 NIB for $530, no mount however, is that worth jumping on ASAP?
 

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Neither, off set iron sights.
 

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I prefer offset irons, KACs actually.

If you use a small RDS, use whatever floats your boat and your wallet can sustain. T/H-1, RMR, JPoint, Inforce, whatever.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I prefer offset irons, KACs actually.

If you use a small RDS, use whatever floats your boat and your wallet can sustain. T/H-1, RMR, JPoint, Inforce, whatever.
I hear you and I thought about that, only problem with irons is their diminishing use as the sun sets.
 

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I hear you and I thought about that, only problem with irons is their diminishing use as the sun sets.
Valid concern.

Like all things with firearms, trade offs typically to be made and the wise person tailors those trade offs to their intended use.
 

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I hear you and I thought about that, only problem with irons is their diminishing use as the sun sets.
Flashlights; the sight picture will silhouette against an illuminated background. You shouldn't be pulling the trigger without proper identification first anyways, but if you must go full ninja, get a set of offset iron sights with tritium inserts.
 

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For those of you that have got aimpoint micros or trijicon rmr's mounted on offset mounts I have a question. Can you use the offset red dot sights without having to tilt the rifle? For just having fun at the range I can see where doing so would not be an issue. However if I was ever using the rifle for anything serious I'd probably be wearing my heavy armor and honestly chanting the rifle while wearing my heavy armor is just not going to be a fluid operation. And honestly I run an un magnified EoTech on my duty M4 so I don't want to commit any sort of canting to muscle memory as it would be of no benefit when I would be most likely to need a rifle. I guess I'm just wondering if there's enough adjustment in an aimpoint micro or an RMR to be able to get them on target out to 25 yards while looking at the sight from the same non canted position that I would use with a standard scope? Thanks for the input.
 

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After extensive experience and hard use with both (I own both)....there is only one real choice....the Aimpoint Micro....and get the 4MOA not the 2MOA as you will be using it for close range engagements only if it is on an offset mount.

The Aimpoint's battery will last about 4 years but I recommend changing it every time you do your taxes (as a reminder to do it) just in case....if you are looking for ultra reliability.....it will serve you well. My Aimpoints have kept zero no matter what we have done to them....from hard field and competition use to being banged around by the baggage monkeys at the airport every month for the past 4+ years to literally falling off the bed of a truck at 30 mph. They don't fog up, they have a clear sight picture and the brightest dot you will get in an offset optic. I have carried them and my son has run them for 4 years of 3Gun competition using them on his rifle, pistol and shotgun without a single issue. My son shoots top 10 in major 3Gun matches and has won 3 National Championships with the Aimpoint Micros....THEY WORK!

The RMR is a great optic but here is why you don't want the RMR for a critical situation optic
1) The RMR will fog up in bad weather
2) It will run out of battery on you with very little warning if you use the LED models
3) The dot will wash out on you if you go from light to dark quickly (like entering a room or cave) with the dual illum models
4) The glass in the optic is coated and tinted for its and your eyes protection.....but it will change/warp your view of the target
5) It is rugged but not nearly as rugged as the Aimpoint Micro.....they are not even in the same ball park for ruggedness


So this is just my two cents worth....but it is two cents learned thru thousands of dollars and years of extreme use.....
 

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For those of you that have got aimpoint micros or trijicon rmr's mounted on offset mounts I have a question. Can you use the offset red dot sights without having to tilt the rifle? For just having fun at the range I can see where doing so would not be an issue. However if I was ever using the rifle for anything serious I'd probably be wearing my heavy armor and honestly chanting the rifle while wearing my heavy armor is just not going to be a fluid operation. And honestly I run an un magnified EoTech on my duty M4 so I don't want to commit any sort of canting to muscle memory as it would be of no benefit when I would be most likely to need a rifle. I guess I'm just wondering if there's enough adjustment in an aimpoint micro or an RMR to be able to get them on target out to 25 yards while looking at the sight from the same non canted position that I would use with a standard scope? Thanks for the input.

Bottom line up front....not really....not if you want the effectiveness and speed of the offset optic.

Having said that, not all offset mounts are created equal. The LaRue offset mount is at the proper length and angle to allow you to tilt the rifle 45 degrees and be right on target. The majority of the other mounts out there are not the right dimensions and you will have to search for the optic and dot. As for the speed and effectiveness of using it with and without armor on.... if you have the LaRue mount, you don't break cheek weld at all, simply rotate the rifle 45 degrees (allowing your cheek to slide on the buttstock) and you are on target instantly. If you are doing it correctly, your buttstock is moving away from your kit and you should have not impairments. All of the Tier units are using them with great success.... as are many of the White SOF and conventional maneuver units.

The offset optic (and Dueck Defense irons) are the only way to go in competition in either Open or the Limited classes. If you have a magnified optic, the offset optic or Dueck irons will allow close engagements without any changes in magnification of your primary optic and will be the ultimate solution for the close to far to close engagements. If you have an unmagnified optic (as you suggested) there is little use for an offset aiming system unless you want more speed for extreme close range threats (under 5 yards) without having to account for the boresight differential....otherwise it is just added weight and bulk.....you would be better off shooting more and learning your hold under.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
After extensive experience and hard use with both (I own both)....there is only one real choice....the Aimpoint Micro....and get the 4MOA not the 2MOA as you will be using it for close range engagements only if it is on an offset mount.

The Aimpoint's battery will last about 4 years but I recommend changing it every time you do your taxes (as a reminder to do it) just in case....if you are looking for ultra reliability.....it will serve you well. My Aimpoints have kept zero no matter what we have done to them....from hard field and competition use to being banged around by the baggage monkeys at the airport every month for the past 4+ years to literally falling off the bed of a truck at 30 mph. They don't fog up, they have a clear sight picture and the brightest dot you will get in an offset optic. I have carried them and my son has run them for 4 years of 3Gun competition using them on his rifle, pistol and shotgun without a single issue. My son shoots top 10 in major 3Gun matches and has won 3 National Championships with the Aimpoint Micros....THEY WORK!

The RMR is a great optic but here is why you don't want the RMR for a critical situation optic
1) The RMR will fog up in bad weather
2) It will run out of battery on you with very little warning if you use the LED models
3) The dot will wash out on you if you go from light to dark quickly (like entering a room or cave) with the dual illum models
4) The glass in the optic is coated and tinted for its and your eyes protection.....but it will change/warp your view of the target
5) It is rugged but not nearly as rugged as the Aimpoint Micro.....they are not even in the same ball park for ruggedness


So this is just my two cents worth....but it is two cents learned thru thousands of dollars and years of extreme use.....
Thanks for the great write up!
 

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IME, KAC offset are employed as Loki describes, simply roll the rifle while maintaining cheek weld to get a sight picture.
 
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