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According to The American Rifleman, they were getting about 2.5" 5-shot groups at 50 yd. That sounds pretty bad! 
http://www.nrapublications.org/TAR/Bullpups.asp
http://www.nrapublications.org/TAR/Bullpups.asp
PS90 accuracy
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I read it and it sounds odd to me
I get that he wasnt using magnification so 50yrs the groupings can be off but the guy had a sandbag. As I read on in the article he had the same perofrmance with the .223 at 100 yards. Using a 1moa sight with no magnification can explain the difference in an inch but the use of a sandbag should mitigate that. Now I have to go to an outdoor range and test it myself at 50yrds. I have found that I get more accurate shots if I line up the tartget then pull the trigger about 1/2 way and then hold still stop breathing and pull the rest of the way. The long trigger pull of the PS90 could be effecting his shooting - But I'd be embarrassed if I could only get 2" average from any system using a sandbag. Also a professional shooter should account for trigger pull.
I get that he wasnt using magnification so 50yrs the groupings can be off but the guy had a sandbag. As I read on in the article he had the same perofrmance with the .223 at 100 yards. Using a 1moa sight with no magnification can explain the difference in an inch but the use of a sandbag should mitigate that. Now I have to go to an outdoor range and test it myself at 50yrds. I have found that I get more accurate shots if I line up the tartget then pull the trigger about 1/2 way and then hold still stop breathing and pull the rest of the way. The long trigger pull of the PS90 could be effecting his shooting - But I'd be embarrassed if I could only get 2" average from any system using a sandbag. Also a professional shooter should account for trigger pull.
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2,293 Posts
Re: I read it and it sounds odd to me
As this will increase the MOA 2x or even 3x at 100.
This is another reason why we should not attach ANYTHING to the barrel, like fake cans, or sling attachments. Let the barrel free float and do not touch it whatsoever.
Cheers,
-TH
Whatever you do - DO NOT REST THE BARREL ON THE SANDBAG!Davis said:
As this will increase the MOA 2x or even 3x at 100.
This is another reason why we should not attach ANYTHING to the barrel, like fake cans, or sling attachments. Let the barrel free float and do not touch it whatsoever.
Cheers,
-TH
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445 Posts
My latest AAR showed I was getting about 2" 10-15+ shot groups at 25 yd from a sandbag rest (NOT on the barrel, LOL) using the MC-10-80, and 4.75"-5" 10-15+ shot groups at 50 yd in the same conditions, all using SS195.
Personally, I think the biggest problem is the MC-10-80 as it is extremely difficult to get a consistent point of aim each time unless the light, literally, hits the front fiber optic collector in the right position to illuminate the circle/dot reticle enough to contrast with paper targets.
Another person on AR15.com (Scool) was getting decent sized 10-20 shot groups at 25 yd using a Bushnell Holosight, which reinforces the view that the MC-10-80 is the source of "accuracy" problems.
The people that proclaim the MC-10-80 is perfect and there's nothing wrong with it, are either liars speaking from anecdotal 2nd or 3rd hand experience or shot their PS90 in a place where the light struck the MC-10-80 perfectly, or had the so-called "revised" reflex sights. After numerous calls to FNH, it's clear that they're not going to do anything for the early reflex sights so my MC-10-80 is coming off as soon as possible. Ring Sights also declined to comment about their reflex sights.
Personally, I think the biggest problem is the MC-10-80 as it is extremely difficult to get a consistent point of aim each time unless the light, literally, hits the front fiber optic collector in the right position to illuminate the circle/dot reticle enough to contrast with paper targets.
Another person on AR15.com (Scool) was getting decent sized 10-20 shot groups at 25 yd using a Bushnell Holosight, which reinforces the view that the MC-10-80 is the source of "accuracy" problems.
The people that proclaim the MC-10-80 is perfect and there's nothing wrong with it, are either liars speaking from anecdotal 2nd or 3rd hand experience or shot their PS90 in a place where the light struck the MC-10-80 perfectly, or had the so-called "revised" reflex sights. After numerous calls to FNH, it's clear that they're not going to do anything for the early reflex sights so my MC-10-80 is coming off as soon as possible. Ring Sights also declined to comment about their reflex sights.
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940 Posts
The last time I was shooting I got a 4 inch group sitting at 50 yards. And a 1.3 inch group resting on the hood of a car at 75 yards.
I only did one group at each range increment- we were testing for drop, not accuracy. (ss195)
I shoot competitively and am not pleased with the groups. I must blame the long travel and heavy pull of the trigger. The nice group I shot from the hood of the car leads me to believe that the PS90/ ss195 combo is actually quite consistent.
Tomorrow I'm going to go out and try our modified trigger.
Nick
I only did one group at each range increment- we were testing for drop, not accuracy. (ss195)
I shoot competitively and am not pleased with the groups. I must blame the long travel and heavy pull of the trigger. The nice group I shot from the hood of the car leads me to believe that the PS90/ ss195 combo is actually quite consistent.
Tomorrow I'm going to go out and try our modified trigger.
Nick
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Re: I read it and it sounds odd to me
I found myself starting the shot with the trigger half pulled as well.Davis said:
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I did a little shooting yesterday with my lightened trigger pull. I shoot sub 1" 3-shot groups @ 25, 50, 75, and 100 yards. SS195, EoTech. I was resting over the hood of a jeep, I shot all the groups in succession with one or two breaths between shoots.
With a zero at 50 yards I hit
-2.25" @ 25 yards
0 @50
+2.75 @ 75
+5.5 @ 100
I did some five-shot groups @ 100 yards, allowing myself less than a second per shot, these groups were mostly 2" wide x 5" high.
With a zero at 50 yards I hit
-2.25" @ 25 yards
0 @50
+2.75 @ 75
+5.5 @ 100
I did some five-shot groups @ 100 yards, allowing myself less than a second per shot, these groups were mostly 2" wide x 5" high.
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940 Posts
is your 10" a typo?
I haven't shot my PS90 since the above post. Next time I'll try a ten shot group at 100 yards, just for you.
I haven't shot my PS90 since the above post. Next time I'll try a ten shot group at 100 yards, just for you.
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23 Posts
Has anybody tried hand loading a .223 55 grain bullet in 5.7x28 brass and testing the accuracy?
I think at 1030fps from a 10.5" barrel that it will stablize, but not sure due to the TAC-16 I will put on it.
I think at 1030fps from a 10.5" barrel that it will stablize, but not sure due to the TAC-16 I will put on it.
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I have loaded and fired a couple of hundred 55 grain FMJs and fired them through my PS90. I did not have an opportunity to seriously fire them for group, but beverage cans at 50 to 60 meters were in danger while firing offhand. I hit most of the time, and when I missed, it always felt like it was my fault.GlockandRoll said:
I was around 1600 FPS, I feel that they would stabilize at a lower velocity. After all, FN loads a subsonic round with basically the same bullet.
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I wonder how I could keep them subsonic?
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411 Posts
brand new out of the box, my ps90 gave me 3-3.5" groups at 100yards using my arms resting on a table at slow controlled fire, and when rapidfiring a full 50rnd mag (about 4 shots per second), I got 13" groups at 100yards.
I was pretty happy about the performance of the ps90 to say the least.
Funny to hear some people put it down as a peashooter because of it's size and the 5.7rounds , but who cares. They just jealous and have small brains.
I'll be doing some testing about it's penetration and wounding when the weather gets warmer, but until then it is my main SHTF rifle to grab.
ps. I have a Bushnell Holo on it now, I wonder if that would get me any better groupings . Indoor ranges won't let me shoot the ps90 and too cold out to go outdoors.
I was pretty happy about the performance of the ps90 to say the least.
Funny to hear some people put it down as a peashooter because of it's size and the 5.7rounds , but who cares. They just jealous and have small brains.
I'll be doing some testing about it's penetration and wounding when the weather gets warmer, but until then it is my main SHTF rifle to grab.
ps. I have a Bushnell Holo on it now, I wonder if that would get me any better groupings . Indoor ranges won't let me shoot the ps90 and too cold out to go outdoors.
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I wound worry about that, it's nearly the same wound potential as a .22mag.. . at least that is what PS90 shooters I know tell me as the cant get the real ammo the gun was designed for.
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I just read a magazine article this evening with a review of the round and the 2 guns that shoot it. It showed stats that put it in the 9mm damage range.GlockandRoll said:
Go here for my mini comment on the article, along with the name of the magazine if U wanna read it yourself.
http://ps90forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1860#1860
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About 2 months ago, I was hyped up about this gun... but honestly, I'm really glad I didn't get one and instead invested in a nice SBR M4 with ACOG and TAC-16.
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13,434 Posts
Well, I almost bought an AR, but went with this. I do not regret it at all. Quieter. More ergonomic. Easier to clean and take apart. This is my 1st rifle. I never held one that I cared for. And, I am right handed but left eye dominate. The high eotech is great for me using my left eye.
Since buying it, however, it has ignited my interests in rifles. I've also found that while I love using my left eye for close distances. My right eye actually sees better at a further distance. So, at 50 yards and beyond, I'm still using the right eye. So, because of that, I kinda want an AR now. Still haven't decided if I will, because I'll have to sell 1, or 2 pistols, depending on which AR I would get.
But, the PS90 is my dream rifle. I have it set up like I want. And, while the short barrel does look kewl, I pick up more velocity with the longer barrel. And, after what I read tonight, I'm not really worried about the ammo wounding potential (I might have been if I had a 5-7 pistol).
If I can get my hands on more 195, I may switch over to that, and make the minor sight in adjustments I might need to (I've used 197 exclusively so far). The 195 is sufficient for what I want the gun for. I have no plans to shoot past 100 yards, and 90% of my shots are at 50 yards because 100 is just to damn far to see w/o magnification.
Since buying it, however, it has ignited my interests in rifles. I've also found that while I love using my left eye for close distances. My right eye actually sees better at a further distance. So, at 50 yards and beyond, I'm still using the right eye. So, because of that, I kinda want an AR now. Still haven't decided if I will, because I'll have to sell 1, or 2 pistols, depending on which AR I would get.
But, the PS90 is my dream rifle. I have it set up like I want. And, while the short barrel does look kewl, I pick up more velocity with the longer barrel. And, after what I read tonight, I'm not really worried about the ammo wounding potential (I might have been if I had a 5-7 pistol).
If I can get my hands on more 195, I may switch over to that, and make the minor sight in adjustments I might need to (I've used 197 exclusively so far). The 195 is sufficient for what I want the gun for. I have no plans to shoot past 100 yards, and 90% of my shots are at 50 yards because 100 is just to damn far to see w/o magnification.
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23 Posts
My recommendation for an AR is to get an essential forged lower and a model1sales chrome-lined M4 kit. You will spend under $600 and have all the rifle you will need. If you want to get something accurate, get a DPMS stainless varmint model, or the Clark gator, both shoot .25moa with match ammo.
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13,434 Posts
Actually, I want a quadrail setup. I'm looking at either a RRA or what I really want is the S&W TAC AR. It has folding front and rear sights, and the rail setup I really want. Saw several comments on it on the AR15 forum. Everyone likes them. And, U can't put the rifle together for the price U can get it for ($1200, if U look really hard).
To buy that one, I'd have to sell 2 guns, however. Not sure what I will do. I've floundered on it several times just over the past week. I wonder if I should bother, as the PS90 is set up just like I want. And, I've held many Ars (including the S&W one I want), and nothing is as ergonomic to me as the PS90. I can live w/ selling my USPc, I suppose, and getting a RRA by the end of the year. Not sure I wanna sell my Glock 34 too, to buy the S&W one.
I don't know....
To buy that one, I'd have to sell 2 guns, however. Not sure what I will do. I've floundered on it several times just over the past week. I wonder if I should bother, as the PS90 is set up just like I want. And, I've held many Ars (including the S&W one I want), and nothing is as ergonomic to me as the PS90. I can live w/ selling my USPc, I suppose, and getting a RRA by the end of the year. Not sure I wanna sell my Glock 34 too, to buy the S&W one.
I don't know....
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you can get a YHM quad rail from M1s.com and all the parts you needed for you stripped lower for $645.00
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