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I have a SCAR 16 and want to purchase the 14" barrel. Can I pin the muzzle device to avoid making it a class 3 ?? Looking at a 14" on Gun Broker it says "No" to needing an FFL. I'm guessing once it is attached to an upper its a class 3 unless I pin it to make it a 16" barrel....?
 

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If the muzzle device is pinned and welded to a total length of 16" you're good. You can order the sbr barrels directly without a FFL. But installing without a stamp is a big NO.
 

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I have a SCAR 16 and want to purchase the 14" barrel. Can I pin the muzzle device to avoid making it a class 3 ?? Looking at a 14" on Gun Broker it says "No" to needing an FFL. I'm guessing once it is attached to an upper its a class 3 unless I pin it to make it a 16" barrel....?
I had my 16s cut down to 10.5". It performs falwlessly, though I had to install a larger gas screw in the block. Minor adjustments so it would cycle with a suppressor & subsonic ammo. It can be cut down rather easily by one who knows what they're doing...
 

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You can order the sbr barrels directly without a FFL. But installing without a stamp is a big NO.
Not exactly. I mean, yeah what you said is true -- you can order without an FFL, and installing without a stamp is a big no, but there's more to it than that...

Owning a 14" barrel (i.e. ordering it and shipping it to your house) is by the letter of the law an NFA violation if you own a SCAR that it could go on. It qualifies as constructive intent, technically even if you own the barrel and its in a different location.

To be legal, if you order it and ship it to your dealer (he doesn't need to be a class 3 dealer, he just needs to hold the barrel so that you don't take possession of it while you have possession of your SCAR) and then have him do the pin/weld before you take posession, you're legal and you can do whatever you want as a pin/weld muzzle device becomes part of the OAL so if it's a 16" barrel with the pin/weld that's a 16" barrel. You can take a 10" barrel and pin/weld a 6" muzzle device and its legal.

if you didn't own a SCAR you could order a hundred of the barrels and do whatever you want with them. but as soon as you have ownership of a short-barrel and a receiver(platform) on which it can be assembled in an NFA configuration you're technically in violation.

In the AR world you can cover yourself by having an AR pistol as thats a legal host for the short barrel, even if its an extra short barrel. but with a scar barrel you have no legal host (unless you've already gotten your $200 tax stamp, engraved the item, etc).

All that said, is it likely that you will be investigated for constructive intent if you order a 14" barrel off the internet and once received take it directly to a gunsmith for a pin/weld? Probably not. But I also don't like taking chances involving any sort of probability when it comes to a potential federal firearms violation... so for my book, order it shipped to your dealer and have it pinned/welded before you ever take possession.

Or, as I've done per my signature, have a barrel "on order" meaning "on hold" with your dealer until your tax stamp is approved, your receiver is engraved, and then and only then complete your purchase and take possession of your now-legal SBR barrel :)
 

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Not exactly.

Owning a 14" barrel (i.e. ordering it and shipping it to your house) is by the letter of the law an NFA violation if you own a SCAR that it could go on. It qualifies as constructive intent, technically even if you own the barrel and its in a different location.

To be legal, if you order it and ship it to your dealer (he doesn't need to be a class 3 dealer, he just needs to hold the barrel so that you don't take possession of it while you have possession of your SCAR) and then have him do the pin/weld before you take posession, you're legal and you can do whatever you want as a pin/weld muzzle device becomes part of the OAL so if it's a 16" barrel with the pin/weld that's a 16" barrel. You can take a 10" barrel and pin/weld a 6" muzzle device and its legal.

if you didn't own a SCAR you could order a hundred of the barrels and do whatever you want with them. but as soon as you have ownership of a short-barrel and a receiver(platform) on which it can be assembled in an NFA configuration you're technically in violation.

In the AR world you can cover yourself by having an AR pistol as thats a legal host for the short barrel, even if its an extra short barrel. but with a scar barrel you have no legal host (unless you've already gotten your $200 tax stamp, engraved the item, etc).
Fair enough. Thanks for clarifying.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Very Good Info! I'm in the process of getting a trust now, gonna go with the 10.5 barrel. If I'm gonna go short I might as well do it right.
 

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Not exactly. I mean, yeah what you said is true -- you can order without an FFL, and installing without a stamp is a big no, but there's more to it than that...

Owning a 14" barrel (i.e. ordering it and shipping it to your house) is by the letter of the law an NFA violation if you own a SCAR that it could go on. It qualifies as constructive intent, technically even if you own the barrel and its in a different location.

To be legal, if you order it and ship it to your dealer (he doesn't need to be a class 3 dealer, he just needs to hold the barrel so that you don't take possession of it while you have possession of your SCAR) and then have him do the pin/weld before you take posession, you're legal and you can do whatever you want as a pin/weld muzzle device becomes part of the OAL so if it's a 16" barrel with the pin/weld that's a 16" barrel. You can take a 10" barrel and pin/weld a 6" muzzle device and its legal.

if you didn't own a SCAR you could order a hundred of the barrels and do whatever you want with them. but as soon as you have ownership of a short-barrel and a receiver(platform) on which it can be assembled in an NFA configuration you're technically in violation.

In the AR world you can cover yourself by having an AR pistol as thats a legal host for the short barrel, even if its an extra short barrel. but with a scar barrel you have no legal host (unless you've already gotten your $200 tax stamp, engraved the item, etc).

All that said, is it likely that you will be investigated for constructive intent if you order a 14" barrel off the internet and once received take it directly to a gunsmith for a pin/weld? Probably not. But I also don't like taking chances involving any sort of probability when it comes to a potential federal firearms violation... so for my book, order it shipped to your dealer and have it pinned/welded before you ever take possession.

Or, as I've done per my signature, have a barrel "on order" meaning "on hold" with your dealer until your tax stamp is approved, your receiver is engraved, and then and only then complete your purchase and take possession of your now-legal SBR barrel :)

That "dealer" better be an 07/02 SOT if he has a SCAR in his shop. If not, he COULD be in for a lot of explaining IF he were paid a compliance inspection.

-SS
 

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That "dealer" better be an 07/02 SOT if he has a SCAR in his shop. If not, he COULD be in for a lot of explaining IF he were paid a compliance inspection.

-SS
I don't know of dealer who would really want it in his shop, but then again if the dealer is a gunsmith doing barrel work he probably pays for the extra NFA SOT. At least that is what I would do if I was pin & welding 14" barrels.

Also is it breaking the law if you have a 14" barrel shipped to your house and before opening it take it to a family or friends house and open it there to make sure it's not damaged. Then giving it to them to lock up and not let you have it to your Tax stamp comes back? I would think that there is no "intent" to break the law since you opened the package away from your home and had them lock it away from you. The definition of Intent is the design or purpose to commit a wrongful or criminal act. I'm just curious on what you all thought. I've done that for family and friends in the past. It was in my safe and absolutely no way for them to access it.
 

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"Intent" can be interpreted narrowly or broadly. It would be a lot harder for the government to make the argument that you intended on manufacturing an SBR without the stamp if the short barrel is at a completely different location than the rifle itself. This is not to mention the issue of how the feds would come to obtain both the rifle and barrel from both places as evidence against you. Seems extremely unlikely anyone with the rifle at home and the barrel at a family member's location would have an issue with the feds. But, that's not to say that if they somehow got the evidence against you and they were able to connect the dots that they couldn't still charge you with a crime.
 

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I have read before that if you don't have independent access to the place it's stored, such as keeping it at a friend’s house that you don't have the keys to, that generally meets the bar of not being "in your possession". I was also looking at buying the 14” barrel to have it pinned and I planned to just take it right to the gunsmith to have the work performed as soon as it arrived. Otherwise I would give it to a trusted friend (without a SCAR 16!) to keep at his house until the work was done.
 

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"Total length" keeps being mentioned.
What is total length?
Is it literally the length from one end to the other including a trunion? Or is it from the face of the bolt to the other end?
Ask Randy Weaver if 1/16th's of an inch matter to a prosecuter.
 

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"Total length" keeps being mentioned.
What is total length?
Is it literally the length from one end to the other including a trunion? Or is it from the face of the bolt to the other end?
What was explained to me was from the face of the chamber between the bolt and the barrel extention to the tip of the barrel, this would be either from the crown of the barrel on a barrel without a pinned muzzle device or to the tip of the pinned muzzle device. Others have said they have been told it's the same procedure but measured from the face of the bolt to the tip of the crown or pinned muzzle device. I think this small difference in measuring is why most manufactures just go ahead and make the barrel length 16 1/4" to 16 1/2" over all length.
 

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Yes I was also explained that the ATF shoves a rod down the barrel on a closed bolt and measures where the rod comes out for total length.

But yeah, watch out for that 1/16 of an inch. It would/could matter to a prosecutor and boy that would suck.


These NFA laws are absolute GARBAGE anyways and really really need to be done away with.

Geez Louise...
 

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Yes I was also explained that the ATF shoves a rod down the barrel on a closed bolt and measures where the rod comes out for total length.

But yeah, watch out for that 1/16 of an inch. It would/could matter to a prosecutor and boy that would suck.


These NFA laws are absolute GARBAGE anyways and really really need to be done away with.

Geez Louise...
Couldn't agree with you more that the NFA laws need to be done away with.....What do we really have these days...Silencers, SBR's, SBS's, AOW's, and DD's. The government has accomplished in making select fire firearms banned basically...they are so expensive that only the super wealthy can purchase them. Silencers are safety devices not hollywood BS. SBR's are basically pistols. AOW's.....come one putting a foregrip on a pistol....idiots....AOW's....what?...DD's...isn't everything a destructive device?
 

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What was explained to me was from the face of the chamber between the bolt and the barrel extension to the tip of the barrel, this would be either from the crown of the barrel on a barrel without a pinned muzzle device or to the tip of the pinned muzzle device. Others have said they have been told it's the same procedure but measured from the face of the bolt to the tip of the crown or pinned muzzle device. I think this small difference in measuring is why most manufactures just go ahead and make the barrel length 16 1/4" to 16 1/2" over all length.
Bolt face to longest fixed spot on the barrel assembly, whether it be muzzle crown or muzzle device is the answer I've been given by numerous ATF inquiries. A weird one is a Noveske KX3 and the removable cone ... since it unscrews, it's not considered part of the overall length when pinning the Pig to a 13.7" barrel. :p
 
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