FN Herstal Firearms banner

1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
227 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
A pistol? A rifle? A PS90?

Nope. The best weapon while driving a car is a car!

We had an unwritten rule in Iraq that "drivers drive and shooter shoot" and it made perfect sense. A car is a great weapon. It has true knockdown power. If you are in an ambush, you don't stop and fight it out. You drive away. Drivers need to have both hands on the wheel, not on the weapon.

This thread will discuss how to use your vehicle as a weapon, and how to use your weapon from a vehicle.

If you have followed my other postings, you probably picked up on the fact that I am all about training. Real training. If you carry a med bag, get training. If you carry a weapon, train! Going to the range and shooting a few rounds at a bullseye is not training. With a vehicle, it is the same. Most people probably don't know how to drive correctly. They surely don't know how to drive combatively if needed.

How much time do you spend a day in your car? Is it worth learning how to drive and fight with it? You can't learn how to drive from the internet, but we can help you in setting up your vehicle, what to look for, and how to use it as a weapon.


The most common emergency situation we had to deal with was flat tires. Anytime you go static in a vehicle in a high threat area, that is an emergency situation. When was the last time you trained at changing your tire? Never I bet. Have you at least inspected the spare and the tools to make sure they work? On my team there was an SOP that the wheel nuts had to be oiled every week. There is nothing worse than a stuck nut while trying to change a flat.

We would do a daily inspection (first parade) of all the vehicles before a mission. You don't need to do as detailed of an inspection, but at least walk around your car and check it out. Don't just go outside and immediately jump in your vehicle. Before you turn the key, turn the steering wheel slightly and apply pressure to the brakes. When the car starts, you should feel the power steering kick it, along with the breaks. Then, when you start going driving down the road, do a rolling break check to make sure your breaks are working well.

Try not to let your vehicle get under a half a tank of gas.

Seat belts. Use them. Belts should be the last thing on, first thing off. Don't put on your seat belt till you are in your car, doors locked, and mobile. When you are getting ready to exit the vehicle, the belt comes off just before you pull into the parking lot, your house, etc. If you are static, a seat belt can be used against you, or slow you down if you have to exit.

We will discuss vehicles and guns later. For now, go and grease your nuts...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
227 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
This recent event shows why you need to be able to correctly deploy a rifle from your vehicle. Also note that the guard feared for his life when the last robber attempted to attack him with his vehicle.

Police: Security guard with assault rifle kills 2 suspected robbers

02:27 PM CDT on Thursday, October 4, 2007


From Staff Reports



A parking lot security guard shot and killed two suspected robbers with an assault rifle Wednesday night in a strip mall near Executive Airport.
2200 West Red Bird Lane

Police said the incident started around 11:30 p.m. when three men attempted to rob the security guard in the parking lot of the shopping center in the 2200 block of West Red Bird Lane.

Two of the three men got out of their car, pointed a gun at the security guard and told him to get out of his vehicle, Dallas police Sgt. Ray Beaudreault said. The security guard then pulled out an automatic rifle, fatally shooting one of them. The other fled on foot.

The third man began to drive away when the security guard, who told police he feared for his life, shot and killed the driver, Sgt. Beaudreault said.

The suspect who fled on foot returned to the vehicle about 15 minutes later to retrieve his cell phone. That’s when police arrested him and charged him with aggravated robbery, police said.

Sgt. Beaudreault said it was unlikely that the guard would be charged in the deaths but the case would be referred to a grand jury.
Dallas:

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/100407dnmetshooting.138951a98.html
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
227 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Same event:

Two teens are dead following a botched robbery of a 20-year-old security guard who fought back early Thursday in southwest Dallas, police said.

The dead are Detavias Davis, 17, and Sergio Vann, 19, according to the Dallas County medical examiner's office.

The incident happened 12:30 a.m. outside a Family Dollar store on Redbird Lane, south of Dallas Executive Airport, formerly Red Bird Airport.

The guard, Dedrick Howard, was using a laptop computer in his vehicle when he was approached by three young men, said Sgt. Ray Beaudreault, a homicide detective.

They ordered him out of the vehicle, and one of the robbers, later identified as Vann, had a handgun, Beaudreault said.

But Howard grabbed an semiautomatic SKS carbine and opened fire, killing Vann, Beaudreault said.

Davis, Beaudreault added, tried to flee in white car, but Howard was worried the teen might also have a gun.

"So, fearing for his life, (Howard) fired again and struck the driver,'' Beaudreault said. "(Davis) drove off, but because of his injuries, he wrecked."

Davis was taken to the hospital from the crash scene on nearby U.S. 67, also called the Marvin D. Love Freeway, but he died later, Beaudreault said.

The third robber, age 17, ran from the parking lot to the wrecked car and he tried to retrieve some personal property from the white car, but police arrested him, Beaudrealt said.

The teen is expected to be charged with aggravated robbery, Beaudreault said.

Howard was not arrested, and the case will be referred to a grand jury to determine if he acted within the law, Beaudreault said.

But, the detective added, Howard "was licensed and authorized to carry that weapon."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,552 Posts
That is one bad ass security guard.

I don't see myself having a rifle in my car as standard equipment, however. Too hard to conceal every time ya get in and outta the car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
227 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Ship,

Note how he used a SKS, which makes a good trunk gun. Cheap enough that you don't have to worry too much about loosing it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,552 Posts
Well, with me having a son now, I can't really leave a gun unsecured in the car. I can't say for sure I can safeguard my keys 24 hours a day.

But yea, otherwise, if U have a way to hide it, I guess it would work.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Proper driving tecniques and tactics are a valuable asset in sticky situations! I attended the Gryphon Group mobile force protection course and it was awesome, Shooting on the move with pistols was rather difficult, and the driving tactics were great not to mention fun as hell getting to wreck out 3 cars in the process!!!!! CARS ARE GREAT WEAPONS!!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Would firing a mossberg 500 at oil drums while a buddy drove my 87 pylmouth granfury thru a cone course we set up count ? P.S i was 18 ...........At a later date i overtrained by doing about 20 T.J Hookers and such toasting the tranny and later responding to my dad that i didnt know how that could have happened .
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
When I used to do tactical training we indeed made a point that cars are great weapons- if you hit the enemy squarely they will be hurt badly if not outright killed. If not the vast majority will dodge out of the way thus screwing with their aim while also getting you farther away from a kill zone.

For vehicle ambushes of unarmored vehicles where getting out of a kill zone was paramout to fighting back we used to train as follows:

Back when we did training a lot of the cars came with those neat hood ornaments. Standard practice if under fire would be to accelerate and lean over viewing straight down the hood. The ornament can be used as a "gun sight" to lock in a shooter and as a visual aid in driving. By leaning way over you put a large percentage of the car between you and incoming. With just ones eyes over the dash you are a very very small target. Most shooters will continue to target where you should be sitting meaning the rounds should miss you.

The above was used only as a means to get out of a kill zone as it is very difficult to drive in this position - basically one handed which means your ability to turn is severely restricted. Once out of a kill zone you pop back up to drive as normal.

Things are probably much different now as I have not been in the training business for well over 17 years. But just figured I'd throw in my two cents on how to use a car as a weapon or survivability platform.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,057 Posts
If that SKS had a folding stock it would be easy to hide one on the passenger front seat. If it didn't have a folding stock he's probably practiced enough to put it in a position to get to it quickly enough to be effective.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
630 Posts
the front bumper on my excursion is the same model as used on the secret service trucks it made out of 1/4 armor plate the rear is 3/16 steel plate coupled with the lifted 9400 lb 450 hp diesel it makes for a formadible weapon
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
car tactics

Make sure you own an automatic - transmission that is. That way you can drive with one hand, shoot with the other , gas and brake with the left foot and kick someones head in with the right.

The law that fits all men fits no one man like a glove. E.W.
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top