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Discussion Starter #81
I think you're assuming that I'm defending Trump here. I didn't vote for him in 2016 nor did I vote for him this year. I voted third party both times because neither earned my vote, in my personal opinion. But I do remember an old saying about not worrying about the speck in someone else's eye when there's a log in your own, and was pointing out the hypocrisy that I saw from many notable people on the left, primarily on social media, immediately following the election.

I was not going to be particularly pleased either way with the 2016 election, so there was no point in wallowing in my sorrows with either result. As such, I kept a clear mind and simply observed the goings on following the 2016 election and this year's election. I was not making a moral argument, I was questioning why people only question the morality only when it favors them. As someone who has mostly libertarian leanings, I tend to notice hypocrisy from both sides, and call it as such. And typically I get the same "revisionist history" or "you don't understand how the world works" accusations from whichever side I call out.

About the "50+1" deal; the founders pretty clearly designed the Constitution to avoid that issue. Unfortunately, that has been eroded over the years. A big hit was when the Constitution was amended to make the position of Senator chosen by direct election, rather than by the respective State legislatures. The individual States no longer have their own voice in the federal government, and they're now little more than extensions of the federal government at this point, in terms of real power. I've also heard many (primarily on the left, but occasionally on the right when it would enable them to ramrod something through by simple majority) advocate to do away with the few remaining checks on a simple 50+1 format. Senator Schumer being one of the more notable to do so recently when he openly advocated for doing away with the filibuster if the Democrats were to retain control of the Senate.

A tyranny by the majority is still a tyranny. And I'm not a fan of a simple majority, of either party, being able to ramrod anything down our throats.
Thanks for your honest discussion! If you don't think Sen. McConnell is the prime mover in all of the goings on of the Senate, well...

Hmmm... I have literally never heard anyone argue against the 17th Amendment before. Go you! The direct election of Senators seems like a no-brainer to me. Why does electing Senators from the state representatives, instead of the people, produce a better outcome?

As per the filibuster... please show me where it exists in the Constitution. Obviously, you can not, because that doesn't exist. The filibuster ultimately tracecs it roots back to the early days of the Republic, when it was difficult to travel. It wasn't really used tactically until 2008, when Sen. McConnoll publicly declared that his top priority was to make Obama a single-term president. Never mind working to improve the lives of Americans--Obama was to be defeated at all costs. If that meant the country should suffer, so be it, so that the Republican candidate would be in a better position in 2012, 2016, 2020, etc...
 

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Thanks for your honest discussion! If you don't think Sen. McConnell is the prime mover in all of the goings on of the Senate, well...

Hmmm... I have literally never heard anyone argue against the 17th Amendment before. Go you! The direct election of Senators seems like a no-brainer to me. Why does electing Senators from the state representatives, instead of the people, produce a better outcome?

As per the filibuster... please show me where it exists in the Constitution. Obviously, you can not, because that doesn't exist. The filibuster ultimately tracecs it roots back to the early days of the Republic, when it was difficult to travel. It wasn't really used tactically until 2008, when Sen. McConnoll publicly declared that his top priority was to make Obama a single-term president. Never mind working to improve the lives of Americans--Obama was to be defeated at all costs. If that meant the country should suffer, so be it, so that the Republican candidate would be in a better position in 2012, 2016, 2020, etc...
What utter BS about the filibuster. The Dems have use it just as much as the Repubs have. Its been around in some form since 1809. Don't blame McConnell for tactically using the filibuster. It has been used by both parties since its inception.

More of your revisionist history writings.

Both parties have used it and both parties have benefited by it. You need to look back a little further than 2008.
 

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Discussion Starter #91
What utter BS about the filibuster. The Dems have use it just as much as the Repubs have. Its been around in some form since 1809. Don't blame McConnell for tactically using the filibuster. It has been used by both parties since its inception.

More of your revisionist history writings.

Both parties have used it and both parties have benefited by it. You need to look back a little further than 2008.
Indeed, both parties have used and benefited by the filibuster. But, check for yourself how often cloture was invoked prior to 2008 and after. The reality is that both sides are not equal.
 

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Indeed, both parties have used and benefited by the filibuster. But, check for yourself how often cloture was invoked prior to 2008 and after. The reality is that both sides are not equal.
Who care how many times they used it. Both sides used it, both sides are equally responsible. Neither side wanted to get rid of it because they both used it. Except now the Dems want to get rid of it because they want to push through a totally liberal agenda if they get the Senate. This reminds me of Obamacare. Lets push it through without any of the 75 million "other" voters supporting it.

This is another one of your discussions that you start and when called on it due to inaccuracies, you try to justify it by Billy used it more than John did.
 

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Who care how many times they used it. Both sides used it, both sides are equally responsible. Neither side wanted to get rid of it because they both used it. Except now the Dems want to get rid of it because they want to push through a totally liberal agenda if they get the Senate. This reminds me of Obamacare. Lets push it through without any of the 75 million "other" voters supporting it.

This is another one of your discussions that you start and when called on it due to inaccuracies, you try to justify it by Billy used it more than John did.
I think I speak for most of us here HK, we applaud the effort to reason with the Doctor however anyone who publicly claims -with a wink too- they are right 90% of the time is no one anyone could ever hope to reason with. I can't even imagine being right 90% of the time, think of all the scars we wouldn't wear to this day. I'll just leave this link below for those who wish to better understand our new "little buddy".

 

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I think I speak for most of us here HK, we applaud the effort to reason with the Doctor however anyone who publicly claims -with a wink too- they are right 90% of the time is no one anyone could ever hope to reason with. I can't even imagine being right 90% of the time, think of all the scars we wouldn't wear to this day. I'll just leave this link below for those who wish to better understand our new "little buddy".

SeaMac, that wink meant i was being supremely sarcastic. Unfortunately, I am probably wrong pretty close to 50% of the time. Most of the 50% of the time I am right is probably due to chance/dumb luck.
 

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What is and has been done to Biden is nothing short of elder abuse. His family should be ashamed but such is the lust for power and sacrifices must be made. If you have listened to any of his recent and past press briefings he clearly is having cognitive issues. Any honest expert will tell you the symptoms are quite advanced. Biden will not make it through the year as President if in fact he is eventually installed. If you claim to not see the cognitive issues Biden is dealing with you are being intellectually dishonest.

If you are willing to accept the results of a third world style election then you must also be willing to accept a third world lifestyle because that is what always eventually follows. And they will not make the effort to separate the friendlies from the enemy down to the citizen level. The ones who support and are cheering this stolen election now will find their backs against the wall right along with the rest of us. Once they have nullified our voting power they have nullified us. All of us. We all become nothing more than subjects of the ruling class and that is the kind of equality none of us will want. This is about so much more than Trump vs. Biden, so much more.
 

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^^^nothing more than the elitist technocrat plan coming to fruition^^^

We either stop it now or yes the US becomes a third world in the sense that only the elite have power and the rest of us are powerless and subject to the daily whim of the elite. Great times ahead for sure...
 
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In an election year filled with very strong emotions, on both sides, votes were cast, and, when most of those legal votes were counted, Joe Biden emerged with a commanding lead in both the electoral colllege votes and ~5 million more popular votes than his opponent, Donald Trump. Despite a lot of complaining and lawsuits filed, the reality, the evidence, and the opinions of every single Republican/Democratic person in charge of state elections has stated, on the record, that their state's election results are free from fraud and/or corruption. At what point is this just a candidate who lost a legitimate election just acting like a sore loser?
Ok nancy go ahead and sell your guns and make sure to wear your mask at all times so you can feel safe
 

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Discussion Starter #99
Ok nancy go ahead and sell your guns and make sure to wear your mask at all times so you can feel safe
Really? "Nancy"? Is that the best you've got? I don't want to sell my guns. I rather like them. I will, however, wear a mask every single time I am indoors outside of my house, because I believe in science over politics and want to do this one little thing to help keep my fellow Americans safe. How about you?
 

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Discussion Starter #100
What is and has been done to Biden is nothing short of elder abuse. His family should be ashamed but such is the lust for power and sacrifices must be made. If you have listened to any of his recent and past press briefings he clearly is having cognitive issues. Any honest expert will tell you the symptoms are quite advanced. Biden will not make it through the year as President if in fact he is eventually installed. If you claim to not see the cognitive issues Biden is dealing with you are being intellectually dishonest.

If you are willing to accept the results of a third world style election then you must also be willing to accept a third world lifestyle because that is what always eventually follows. And they will not make the effort to separate the friendlies from the enemy down to the citizen level. The ones who support and are cheering this stolen election now will find their backs against the wall right along with the rest of us. Once they have nullified our voting power they have nullified us. All of us. We all become nothing more than subjects of the ruling class and that is the kind of equality none of us will want. This is about so much more than Trump vs. Biden, so much more.
"He is having cogntive issues?" Oh, please. If you want to talk about cognitive failures, let's discuss our current president. "Person woman man camera tv..." Yeah, a real cognitive winner, there! Nobody could belive that he tried to pass off a test for dementia as an "accomplishment" but there you go...But, let's actually not discuss that not, becuase we both know Trump and Biden are more or less as coherent as they have ever been...

We recently had an election in this country. It had kind of mixed results, honestly, but, in the top line race, the current president lost to former vp Joe Biden. Despite much wailing and gnashing of teeth by GOP politicians and GOP-friendly media personalities, there has been zero evidence of any fraud or malfeasance. Despute this complete and utter lack of evidence, you somehow claim th 2020 US election was a "third world style election". Talk is cheap. Back up your claims with evidence or go home and admit that President Trump lost, and lost badly. Act like the adult you are, sir. Living in a democratic Republic means that the vote of the people (directly or indirectly) chooses those who govern for us. Your side lost the top line, but did well, down-ballot. Admit reality!
 
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