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Discussion Starter #1
For the past month and a half I have thankfully gotten back into the groove of shooting every weekend, even convinced a good friend to join the FN family then join me on the firing line. Here's my problem, most of those I shoot with usually ask me for tips and instruction on basic fundamentals and more advanced handgun combat, that's all well and good (kinda flattering actually) but I can't seem to shoot slow enough to demonstrate. I actually suck at shooting slow, if I rapid fire (double tapping C.O.M. then single shot to C.N.S. the way Uncle Sam taught me) I'm dead on from 5 to 25 yards but couldn't shoot a respectable group at any range while shooting slow. Anyone else suffer this affliction? What sucks even more, I really want to teach those who ask but find it very difficult to demonstrate accurately at a slower pace.
 

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Just a beginner but my two cents. Maybe really focus on the fundemental steps. I'm a very impatient person and tend to shoot quickly making me very inaccurate. But when I just focus on little things and go through the fundementals of shooting very slowly such as correct grip and focusing on the pulling the trigger straight back I shoot accurately. Also this may help you to catch your beginner friends mistakes and help him/her from creating bad habits from the get go.
 

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Back when I was in boot, during our rifle qual, I always did better during the rapid fires than I did the slow fires. I didnt have time to (over)think about the shots, and for some reason I'm always a better shot when I just do what feels natural and put little thought into it. It's weird. I know it's not the same as what you're experiencing, but it's similar. I think it comes down to reflex rather than cognitive control.
 
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Back when I was in boot, during our rifle qual, I always did better during the rapid fires than I did the slow fires. I didnt have time to (over)think about the shots, and for some reason I'm always a better shot when I just do what feels natural and put little thought into it. It's weird. I know it's not the same as what you're experiencing, but it's similar. I think it comes down to reflex rather than cognitive control.
Agreed with the over thinking, it may also be the "trigger finger flinch" hesitation waiting for the round to go..
 

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Ohh how I know that feeling P-Factor!

SeaMac, I had that problem and for me it really was me overthinking the steps, anymore I just step to the line and let muscle memory take over.
 
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Discussion Starter #8
That's what I'm sensing, I am over thinking the process when in reality shooting a handgun in combat or defensively should be instinctive, I can shoot very accurately if I do so instinctively. It's very difficult to undo a skill I worked very hard to attain.


Back when I was in boot, during our rifle qual, I always did better during the rapid fires than I did the slow fires. I didnt have time to (over)think about the shots, and for some reason I'm always a better shot when I just do what feels natural and put little thought into it. It's weird. I know it's not the same as what you're experiencing, but it's similar. I think it comes down to reflex rather than cognitive control.
 
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Discussion Starter #9
The problem is, my muscles remember shooting at a rapid fire pace, trying to slow it down so I can demonstrate the process is proving quite the challenge. A Palm Beach Sheriff's Deputy friend whose a department Master Firearms Instructor suggested I'm automatically switching to combat mode when I start shooting.



Ohh how I know that feeling P-Factor!

SeaMac, I had that problem and for me it really was me overthinking the steps, anymore I just step to the line and let muscle memory take over.
 

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So let me see if I understand correctly. You are trying to unlearn a skill you spent many years developing and that most of us are training hard to achieve just so you can show others a few things. Not sure that is worth screwing up a good thing however well intentioned.
:mytwocents0:
 

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SeaMac,
I guess it just depends on what you consider slow (my wife just told me that I don't shoot slow ever) when I thought I was.... Personally I would just describe what you will be doing and then perform it a few times I think most people will catch on to what your telling them than to somehow force myself to shoot in what I guess I would call super-slo-mo. If your trying to teach someone how to draw and then fire and your still going to fast for them just find some video's or get someone with a Go-Pro to tape you and then play it back a half or quarter speed :)
 

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Back when I was in boot, during our rifle qual, I always did better during the rapid fires than I did the slow fires. I didnt have time to (over)think about the shots, and for some reason I'm always a better shot when I just do what feels natural and put little thought into it. It's weird. I know it's not the same as what you're experiencing, but it's similar. I think it comes down to reflex rather than cognitive control.
This!
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Mountain,

What I mean by fast is, double-tapping C.O.M. then single-tapping C.N.S. with an empty mag in mere seconds always leaving one in the chamber (never timed myself but it's quick) and I was just thinking "videotaping" today, I do want to share what I have learned but I do not want to tamper with my skills. I was even considering telling my friends to pay a basic instructor not that that would be very friendly.


SeaMac,
I guess it just depends on what you consider slow (my wife just told me that I don't shoot slow ever) when I thought I was.... Personally I would just describe what you will be doing and then perform it a few times I think most people will catch on to what your telling them than to somehow force myself to shoot in what I guess I would call super-slo-mo. If your trying to teach someone how to draw and then fire and your still going to fast for them just find some video's or get someone with a Go-Pro to tape you and then play it back a half or quarter speed :)
 
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You could always try going back to the basics and squeezing the trigger ONLY during the respiratory pause ( between inhale and exhale ). Thats the only way i can get myself to slow down when i'm trigger happy. :arrow:
 

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Discussion Starter #16
No sense going backwards, I'm all for videotaping then slowing down the play back speed, might serve the training purposes well, we'll see. Also, when engaged in combat such as self-defense your breathing will become rapid, not much can be done about that unless you're a robot. The breathing exercise you mention serves its purpose well for target shooting or sniping none of which I am trying to convey to my friends. They want me to teach them what Uncle Sam taught me, at least the abridged version.


You could always try going back to the basics and squeezing the trigger ONLY during the respiratory pause ( between inhale and exhale ). Thats the only way i can get myself to slow down when i'm trigger happy. :arrow:
 

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SeaMac,

Thanks for clarifying :)

I too would really not be willing to alter what close to 30 years of practice/training has gained me....I have shown my wife and children what double taps and such are and my wife sometimes asks...you sure you fired twice? then I say look at the target and you tell me :)

Ohh for any that might end up reading this thread and wonder what COM and CNS is.... Center Of Mass (thoracic aka chest region) and Central Nervous System (head ;) )
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Unfortunately one has to be Politically Correct these days, some folks actually cringe when you mention "body" shots or worse yet "head" shots. Ironically, the only TRUE "stopping" shot is one to the Central Nervous System and people seem so unwilling to practice such shots. I tell EVERYONE I know and will listen, you can dump 3 15rd mags in a persistent miscreant and you might not put them down, conversely ONE to the head usually does the trick. PRACTICE C.N.S. shooting people, practice it often.



Ohh for any that might end up reading this thread and wonder what COM and CNS is.... Center Of Mass (thoracic aka chest region) and Central Nervous System (head ;) )
 

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Don't change yourself. They will just need to watch you faster. :)

Or enlist...

For "political correctness" we call it the body armor drill. Double tap to the body to "stun" the bad guy then one to the head to neutralize the threat.

I actually train alot more than my coworkers. I'm done with the body armor drill before some guys even get on target. And I'm using a Safariland 6360 with the ALS and they have a simple thumb break.

If I can only order my guys to train more.

Last year, I ordered 10k rounds of practice ammo. I personally shot about 60% of it.

I just ordered 20k rounds this fall. Need to stock up, it's hard getting 357sig ammo in.



There's a public range near me which does not allow headshots. I haven't been there in over 15 years.
 
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